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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
 Posted - 23 Feb 2004 : 22:14:39
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Brethren:
Why is it that we all know how to use Strong's Exhuastive Concordance, Thayer's, Brown-Driver-Briggs, and a wide assortment of dictionaries, and etc...that is, up until we come to "the LORD", "GOD" and "JESUS"? Go look up #H3068, #H3050, #G2424 & #H3091 like you do all the other numbers. And yes, He did send the delusion because ye received not a love of the truth, as it is written.
Is there really any one of us who doesn't know that the names have been monkeyed with by the creature [man]?
For crying out loud, Noah Webster knew this way back in 1828 A.D.
"LORD ...When Lord, in the Old Testament, is printed in capitals, it is the translation of JEHOVAH, and so might, with more propriety, be rendered."
PROPRIETY ...Fitness; suitableness; appropriateness; consonance with established principles, rules or customs; justness; accuracy. Propriety of conduct, in a moral sense, consists in its conformity to the moral law..
Easton's Bible Dictionary
Lord
There are various Hebrew and Greek words so rendered.
(1.) Heb. Jehovah, has been rendered in the English Bible Lord, printed in small capitals. This is the proper name of the God of the Hebrews.
If this is "the proper name of the God of the Hebrews", what is the proper name of the God of the Christians? Do they have a different god?
And Mosheh [Moses] did talk face to face with Yahweh or Scripture is not truth. Exodus 33:11 And #H3068 spake unto Moses face to face, as a man speaketh unto his friend.
This was Yahweh the Son of Perpetuity!!
fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisra'el, NOT the STATE OF ISRAEL. |
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Surveyor
Regular Member
USA
31 Posts |
Posted - 23 Feb 2004 : 22:18:32
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No offense taken but He speaks to me here and I call Him
Father. You are still talking labels and the truth of this
matter wont be addressed until all aspects of what constitutes a name are examine.
Peace to you
Clarence
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Manuel
Advanced Member
USA
762 Posts |
Posted - 23 Feb 2004 : 22:45:34
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Greetings to all, In His name, My Father.
Who would judge this man, son of The Highest... Just Us?
I would not, for He Is In His Light, seeking for His Harmony.
Truly I pray for him Godspeed along with His Children.
http://www.travesser.com/passion/movie_trailer_1.html
Dios con Vosotros,
Manuel |
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DanielJacob
Advanced Member
USA
138 Posts |
Posted - 24 Feb 2004 : 00:27:40
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Greetings brothers,
Again, no offense intended. Since we have decided to quote maxims then we should consider these.
"Nomina sunt symbola rerum—Names are the symbols of things." Bouvier's Law Dictionary (1914), "Maxim," p. 2149.
"Nomina sunt notae rerum—Names are the marks of things." Bouvier's Law Dictionary (1914), "Maxim," p. 2148.
"Nomen est quasi rei notamen—A name is as it were a note of a thing." Bouvier's Law Dictionary (1914), "Maxim," p. 2148.
Names, in general, are given by men to things that are subject to them to mark or note them. They are fictions, and not Truth.
The importance of this cannot be stressed enough. In every one of the above maxims of law, the name always refers to a "thing" or "things." Is the Father a thing? Is the Christ a thing?
There is and was no command anywhere in the Scripture given by the Eternal to call Him by any sacred name. We do not hear or read the Eternal instructing anyone to use the terms 'Elohim', 'Yahweh', 'Yashua', 'Jehovah', 'El-Shaddai', 'Adonai'', 'Ha-Shem', 'Adoshem', 'Abba,' or other words that merely describe the Eternal. Everywhere in His Word, love for Him is what is required by Him; nowhere in His word are we told to lust after sacred letters of a sacred name.
Our Lord and Saviour, the Christ, said when we pray, we are to pray to "our Father." He did not use or insist that we use a "sacred" name.
Consider this. By exclusively using a "sacred" name, you are saying you are a stranger to the Eternal. It's like your dad telling you that he won't hear you unless you address him by his "personal" name. A dad doesn't say to his children, "Don't call me dad, call me John." Loving fathers don't say things like that to their children. Likewise, Almighty God is our Father, and we are His children, and He requests only that we call Him 'Father.' "Father" is how the Christ called to Almighty God, and it was additionally used throughout the law, the prophets, and the psalms, for instruction:
"Wilt thou not from this time cry unto Me, My father, Thou art the guide of my youth?" Jeremiah 3:4
"…Thou shalt call Me, My father; and shalt not turn away from Me." Jeremiah 3:19
"He shall cry unto Me, Thou art my father, my God, and the rock of my salvation." Psalms 89:26
"Doubtless Thou art our father, though Abraham be ignorant of us, and Israel acknowledge us not: Thou, O LORD, art our father, our redeemer; Thy name is from everlasting." Isaiah 63:16
"Have we not all one father? hath not one God created us?" Malachi 2:10
If a name is written, does it mean we should call Him only by such a name? Is the meaning of it more important than the written name itself? This is one meaning of God's name and how it is called:
"And He was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and His name is called The Word of God." Revelation 19:13
We see that if one really desires to know the Eternal's "sacred" name, they must first know the Word of God, and do His Will and obey His Law. This is our Father's command for all of us. He does not command us to exclusively call Him by any "personal" name, but to keep His Word! That is truly keeping His name "sacred."
Peace brothers. |
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Manuel
Advanced Member
USA
762 Posts |
Posted - 24 Feb 2004 : 01:00:30
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"But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven." |
Edited by - Manuel on 24 Feb 2004 01:01:29 |
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DanielJacob
Advanced Member
USA
138 Posts |
Posted - 24 Feb 2004 : 01:40:48
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Manuel; Who is denying the Christ? Not I!
onisraelite wrote:
quote:
It is written, not by us, but by the King Himself...argue with Him.
Therefore my people shall know my name: therefore they shall know in that day that I am he that doth speak: behold, it is I.
"Now therefore, what have I here, saith the LORD, that my people is taken away for nought? they that rule over them make them to howl, saith the LORD; and my name continually every day is blasphemed. Therefore my people shall know my name: therefore they shall know in that day that I am he that doth speak: behold, it is I.
How beautiful upon the mountains are the feet of him that bringeth good tidings, that publisheth peace; that bringeth good tidings of good, that publisheth salvation; that saith unto Zion, Thy God reigneth!"
So, am I to presume that those that use the more prevalent English version of YHWH [i.e. God, Jehoshua, Jesus, Jehovah] are blasphemers? Is that your charge? I am just trying to understand, because if my relationship with Father is in jeopardy then I surely want to make amends and repent.
I have shown clearly from the Scriptures that there is no commandment from the Eternal that we are to use a "sacred" name. If I am wrong then please instruct me, using Scripture to verify Scripture.
From Vincent's Word Studies of the New Testament:
Jesus (Ihsou~n). (Yehowshuwa) The Greek form of a Hebrew name, which had been born by two illustrious individuals in former periods of the Jewish history — Joshua, the successor of Moses, and Jeshua, the high-priest, who with Zerubbabel took so active a part in the re-establishment of the civil and religious polity of the Jews on their return from Babylon. Its original and full form is Jehoshua, becoming by contraction Joshua or Jeshua. Joshua, the son of Nun, the successor of Moses, was originally name Hoshea (saving), which was altered by Moses into Jehoshua (Jehovah (our) Salvation) (Numbers 13:16). The meaning of the name, therefore, finds expression in the title Savior, applied to our Lord (Luke 1:47, 2:11; John 4:42).
Why doesn't this example carry just a much weight as Noah Webster?
Peace brothers.
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2-elect
Occasional Poster
USA
7 Posts |
Posted - 24 Feb 2004 : 01:47:25
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Edited by - 2-elect on 24 Feb 2004 12:09:45 |
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Manuel
Advanced Member
USA
762 Posts |
Posted - 24 Feb 2004 : 01:49:28
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Daniel,
I understand, please do not be offended by the Words I posted, In Him, Father. They Are what they Are.
A Dios,
Manuel
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2-elect
Occasional Poster
USA
7 Posts |
Posted - 24 Feb 2004 : 01:55:50
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quote:
Originally posted by Manuel
Daniel,
I understand, please do not be offended by the Words I posted, In Him, Father. They Are what they Are.
A Dios,
Manuel
Why do you use Dios the name of Greek god, for the Father? The greek name for Zeus? and Yet reject His true Name?????
They have also given Yahuah the name of "Zeus" as a replacement for His title of Elohim in the translations of many bibles for other languages. I must ask, "Who has inspired these translators to give the name of a Greek deity to Yahuah, and why would Christian leaders continue to teach such lies?"
* NT:2203 Zeus (dzyooce); of uncertain affinity; in the oblique cases there is used instead of it a (probably cognate) name Dis (deece), which is otherwise obsolete;
* Zeus or Dis (among the Latins, Jupiter or Jove), the supreme deity of the Greeks: KJV-Jupiter.
* Zeus {Diós Dio\ Interlinear Transliterated Bible (Interlinear Transliterated Bible. Copyright (c) 1994 by Biblesoft)
Dis, Dios, Dio, Deus, Diyos, Dieu, Zeus, are transliterated names for the Greek deity Dios. These names are used in six different translations for six different languages to represent the Creator of mankind. Salvation did not come from the Greeks, correct? So why are the people of six different languages using the name of a Greek god to express who the Father is? What is wrong with this picture? Here are people from many languages of the world using the Greek name of Zeus to represent a Hebrew Elohim, yet none of the people are Greek. Zeus is the English name for the Greek deity Dios.
Why have most people of many different languages who are not even Greek been given the name of a Greek deity to represent a Hebrew Elohim? Again; what is wrong with this picture? The scriptures below are from translations of Bibles in languages from all over the world. Please note that in all of these languages the transliteration of "Israel" remains the same in all of the translations, but they reject the Hebrew Name given by Yahuah, for a generic title.
* English: (Jesus Christ) Blessed be the Lord God of Israel; for he hath visited and redeemed his people, Luke 1:68 KJV
* Français (Jésus Christ) Luke 1:68 Béni soit le Seigneur, le Dieu d'Israël, De ce qu'il a visité et racheté son peuple
* Deutsch (Jesu Christi,) Luke 1:68 Gepriesen sei der Herr, der Gott Israels , daß er sein Volk angesehen und [ihm] Erlösung geschafft hat.
* Italiano (Gesù Cristo} Luke 1: 68 «Benedetto il Signore Dio d'Israele, perché ha visitato e redento il suo popolo,
* Latin (Iesu Christi) Luke 1: 68 benedictus Deus Israhel quia visitavit et fecit redemptionem plebi suae
* Norsk (Jesu Kristi) Luke 1: 68 Lovet være Herren, Israels Gud , han som så til sitt folk og forløste det!
* Portugues (Jesus Cristo) Luke 1: 68 "Louvado seja o Senhor, o Deus de Israel, porque visitou e redimiu a seu povo.
* Español (Jesucristo) Luke 1: 68 Bendito el Señor Dios de Israel, Que ha visitado y hecho redención á su pueblo,
* Svenska (Jesu Kristi) Luke 1: 68 »Lovad vare Herren, Israels Gud , som har sett till sitt folk och berett det förlossning,
* Tagalog (Jesucristo) Luke 1: 68 Sinabi niya: Purihin ang Panginoon, ang Diyos ng Israel sapagkat dumating siya at tinubos ang kaniyang mga tao.
* Nederlands (Jezus Christus} Luke 1: 68 "Prijs de Here, de God van Israël. Hij heeft Zijn volk bezocht en gered. (Webster's Dictionary for Zeus is also Zus.)
Even in the Old Testament they associate the Father with the name Zeus. The Spanish translation of the Old Testament has Dios associated with a perverted translation of Yahuah's name.
* Español Geb 2:4 Estos son los orígenes de los cielos y de la tierra cuando fueron criados, el día que Jehová Dios
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Edited by - 2-elect on 24 Feb 2004 01:58:12 |
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 24 Feb 2004 : 07:17:40
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Greetings brethren [this term included the sisters]:
Peace be upon the house.
Ezekiel 39:7 So will I make my holy [sacred] name known in the midst of my people...
Holy in the above verse is #H6944 in Strong's Exhaustive Concordance
H6944
qodesh
ko'-desh
From H6942; a sacred...
"I [will] make my sacred name known among my people..."
David in the Psalms:
Psalm 145:21 My mouth shall speak the praise of Yahweh [#H3068]: and let all flesh bless his holy[#H6944, i.e. sacred] name for ever and ever.
Psalm 33:21 For our heart shall rejoice in him, because we have trusted in his sacred[#H6944] name.
By the way George Washington is called "the father of his country"; father means "founder" or "creator", not "daddy". Yahweh or Yahuah is the "founder" of a "peculiar nation".
Webster's 1828 Dictionary of American English
PECU'LIAR, a. [L. peculiaris, from peculium, one's own property, from pecus, cattle.]
1. Appropriate; belonging to a person and to him only.
4. Belonging to a nation, system or other thing, and not to others.
Evidently Yahweh, by His own choice of words, i.e. Peculiar, does not allow dual-citizenship. Something to think about. In order to be a citizen of another nation one must swear an oath of allegiance to that nation thus estranging himself/herself from any other nation. Just something to think about while we ponder the "sacred name".
fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisra'el, NOT the STATE OF ISRAEL. |
Edited by - Oneisraelite on 24 Feb 2004 07:54:04 |
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Surveyor
Regular Member
USA
31 Posts |
Posted - 24 Feb 2004 : 08:42:12
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Labels are needed by men to identify other men because they can't see past the face. A label identifies the person of a man, the face. The Father gave me a unique name from the time of conception. That name is "I am that I am" because I was created in the image of the Creator God. Only He knows the person of the man made in His image. My parents called my name Clarence and those who do not know me hear or see that name and identify me as a person bearing the the image of a man. If a man knows other men or even his god by nothing more than an appellation then in that mans eyes his god or his neighbor will never be anything more to him that what he sees within his own imagination.
I accept a man and the name he goes by at face value but I can't see the face of the Heavenly Father because he wears no mask. I know Him only by his Works and His Word.
The only thing about a name that will matter after the fires have burned out and the dust has settled is whether the "I am" in the man has been conformed to and is one and the same with the "I Am" known as the Father.
Clarence
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Walter
Advanced Member
USA
144 Posts |
Posted - 24 Feb 2004 : 09:14:16
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Numbers 6:
23* Speak unto Aaron and unto his sons, saying, On this wise ye shall bless the children of Israel, saying unto them,
24* The LORD bless thee, and keep thee:
25* The LORD make his face shine upon thee, and be gracious unto thee:
26* The LORD lift up his countenance upon thee, and give thee peace.
27* And they shall put my name upon the children of Israel; and I will bless them.
"And they shall PUT MY NAME UPON the children..."
Quite a flurry of posts have been made since I looked at this last night. There are so many varied and strong points of view of the issue that I have to wonder, like on baptism, like on the calendar, that maybe the true, aka sacred, name of our Father must be important.
I feel I should make known my opinion that the article by John Joseph is garbage and that he should be taken out and flogged for mis-using scripture, imho, to terrify rather than to edify. John Joseph points out that Jesus doesn't use our "God's" true name but then points out that one would not use such a name of distinction if one were included in the meaning of that name. Well, Jesus is God, Father is God, so Jesus would never use God's name (in New or *Old* Testament references) when speaking to His Father. He also somehow neglects to understand (as has been pointed out already) that the English rendering of "Lord" when refering to God is in fact a changing of that sacred name. Sacred not in the sense of magical but in the sense that it is used for the one true God.
"God" is a generic term which, because we've "lost" the original name, we captialize and use to designate our Father. We might as well use the greek "theos" which is used in the NT and the Septuagint. What can be wrong with desiring to know God's true name?? I understand that a name is a fiction of a sort, since a name can never truly describe anyone - and especially not the Creator -, but we all have names we go by and without them ... well, how do we talk with each other? All words are this way. Yet words have power, as we all know, Jesus Christ is the Word of God, a title showing the importance of words, even ours.
Matthew 28:19* Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
Jesus commanded baptism in the name of "God," refering to the three. While I believe it is not *required* to know and use that name - especially since we don't really know it -, how can one say seeking it is evil? We just speak like Jesus did: "in the name of ...", probably knowing that the true name would have been expunged by evil men, may I add. I believe the name can be deduced from scripture, despite, as I believe, that it has been altered.
I'll agree that the many opinions of the name and those insisting only theirs MUST be used constitutes a form of idolatry. But as a generally used name, understanding that a name is just a way to refer to some one or some thing, I think one is as good as another. But I also agree that it is good to avoid names proveably rooted in the names of pagan dieties.
Somehow the name originally known to Adam ..Noah .. Abraham .. Isaac .. Jacob .. Moses and others has been "lost." They knew the name, what the tetragration was and how it was pronounced. But we are required to seek it out if we want to know it. How can anyone fault another for that? We now call God our Father (another generic name, fwiw) as upon our baptisms and ressurections we are HIs children, but when speaking to others and in public setting, I feel the true, historically used, written name should be used if known. (Numbers 6:23-27 as an example.) (Though thinking one knows it and really knowing are, as we all know, different things.)
I personally believe the name is only vowels, four distinct vowels, that sound like Yahweh when the listener is unattentive: IAUE (pure vowels, as in Spanish). I can't prove this yet, and I certainly won't beat on anyone to adopt my belief and insist only the name as I believe it be used. But we must realize that enemies have had much time to lay down false tracks. I view the search for all truth and the continual re-examination of one's beliefs a "Godly" goal; this includes seeking God's true name. Don't you all? |
Edited by - Walter on 24 Feb 2004 09:28:37 |
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DanielJacob
Advanced Member
USA
138 Posts |
Posted - 24 Feb 2004 : 10:32:46
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Brothers Walter, onisraelite, et. al.,
With the exception of your opinion of brother John Joseph, (only because I know him personally and know his heart and his conviction in and to the Christ) I concur with your last post one hundred percent. I was trying to express that we can only rely on the vain attempts of man, because the name has been "lost", through his dictionaries and expositors, to describe that which is indescribable. I am not trying to cast aspersions upon anyone for their calling upon Father by whatever name they believe to be used. I have been before times accused upon these various threads, not this particular thread, of being too rigid in my views, and I am trying to determine that if others perceive this, perhaps it is a failing on my part to truly understand the content and context of what I perceive to be our Fathers intent. I will add only that, like brother John Joseph, when others present the idea that there is only one proper Name or form of worship of the Eternal, that, to me at least, smacks of Phariseeism. Am I wrong; wasn't that the very thing that the Christ spoke concerning them? Have I just misunderstood the original context of this thread? Brothers, help me out here.
May His peace be upon you. |
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2-elect
Occasional Poster
USA
7 Posts |
Posted - 24 Feb 2004 : 12:10:34
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quote:
Originally posted by DanielJacob
I have shown clearly from the Scriptures that there is no commandment from the Eternal that we are to use a "sacred" name. If I am wrong then please instruct me, using Scripture to verify Scripture.
quote:
Originally posted by DanielJacob
Note carefully the bolded words. All the sacred names for God, all types and shadows, are contained in the Law and the Prophets. Note that what was mere shadow or type, i.e., a sacred name for God, will not be remembered any more because it was replaced with substance?by, in and through Christ Jesus:
Hi DJ
If what the author said is true then why do your leaders use the following scriptures to establish your churches?
Joel 2:32 And it shall come to pass That whoever calls on the name of the LORD Shall be saved. For in Mount Zion and in Jerusalem there shall be deliverance, As the LORD has said, Among the remnant whom the LORD calls.
Acts 2:21 And it shall come to pass That whoever calls on the name of the LORD Shall be saved.'
Rom 10:13 For "whoever calls on the name of the LORD shall be saved."
Please remember that the Kodesh name use to be in those scriptures before your leaders broke the third commandment and replaced it with the generic title LORD.
Did Peter and Paul remember to use the Kodesh name when they quoted Joel? Was Peter and Paul led by the Spirit?
Please tell me are the scriptures above a commandment that would put one into the assemblly of Messiah? Please remember what was originally in that prophecy.
What the author has said flys in the face of the scriptures above. The scriptures above are a part of the foundation of Yahshuah's assembly and continues today. And the Kodesh name is a part of it. Those scriptures shoot a big hole in the authors justification for not using the Kodesh Name.
2-elect
PS: Since a sacred name for God, will not be remembered any more because it was replaced with substance by, in and through Christ Jesus: then you use the unsacred name "Jesus Christ," for he is god the son and existed before NT times, correct? |
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 24 Feb 2004 : 15:25:02
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Greetings brethren, this is oneisraelite's helpmeet:
For those interested in the sacred name you may want to check this link out in its entirety. It shows from the Scripture the importance of the sacred name to the Creator, not what men may think on this very important subject. http://www.eliyah.com/yhwhidx.html
fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisra'el, NOT the STATE OF ISRAEL. |
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 24 Feb 2004 : 17:14:07
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Greetings in the name of the King brothers and sisters:
Peace be unto the house.
There are some things we find intriguing about this subject.
In the preface of one edition of virtually every "version" [changing] of the Scriptures that we have seen, there is the information that the sacred name has been supplanted by the generic title "the Lord". If we can agree on this one fact, then we have to ask ourselves this question: If the sacred name is not important, why did the adversary make such an all out effort to erradicate it? And again, if this is true, then the Creator inspired His sacred name into His Set Apart Word nearly 7,000 times in the Old Testament alone, couldn't we assume from this fact that His name was very important to Him?
Forget what "we" think, What does "He" think? His Will be done...that is the important thing.
Notice here in Revelation 16:9 that they don't blaspheme God Himself, they blaspeme the name of, the name belonging to, God.
"And men were scorched with great heat, and blasphemed the name of God, which hath power over these plagues: and they repented not to give him glory."
Paul tells us that in heaven and in earth "there be gods many, and lords many..." If this Scripture is truth, then how can we give Him glory by these titles that are held by MANY?
Now, if [biggest two letter word in the English language], if we can all agree that ba'al means lord...
Easton's Bible Dictionary
Baal
Lord.
...let us put that word in place of Ba'al in these verses of the Scripture and see what we come up with.
How long shall this be in the heart of the prophets that prophesy lies? yea, they are prophets of the deceit of their own heart; Which think to cause my people to forget my name by their dreams which they tell every man to his neighbour, as their fathers have forgotten my name for Lord. IS THIS NOT WHAT HAS HAPPENED? Isn't prophecy fulfilled by our doing just that??? The ineffable name doctrine is a "Jewish fable" and are we not told to give no "heed to Jewish fables, and commandments of men, that turn from the truth"?
"In the Talmud we find instructions that the Name was 'to be hidden,' and in another place we read, 'to be kept secret,' and again, 'disguising it'." Again, we are not to give heed to Jewish fables!!
Could it be that those of us who claim the Set Apart [holy] Scripture [bible] as our Law and use it to defend our position are afraid to use the sacred name of our King because it is no longer in the " vulgar translations" made by the hands of men? Would this be akin to being ashamed of Him? Is this what you meant, Manuel, by posting that verse of the Scripture that you posted? We are told by some that "the paperwork" won't work using the sacred name(s)...then PERHAPS your paperwork is faulty. PERHAPS you will win the battle and gain many followers...and then lose the war.
I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.
Have we PERHAPS done just that?
Here is just a small sampling, with the sacred name put back in, where the pens of the lying scribes have removed it, just to see if we can get a feel for the Will of Yahweh.
And in that day shall ye say, Praise Yahweh[#H3068], call upon his name, declare his doings among the people, make mention that his name is exalted.
Pour out thy fury upon the heathen that know thee not, and upon the families that call not on thy name: for they have eaten up Jacob, and devoured him, and consumed him, and have made his habitation desolate.
O give thanks unto Yahweh [#H3068]; call upon his name: make known his deeds among the people.
Sing unto 'Elohiym, sing praises to his name: extol [exalt] him that rideth upon the heavens by his name YAH [#H3050], and rejoice before him.
Glory ye in his holy [sacred] name: let the heart of them rejoice that seek Yahweh[#H3068].
So will I make my holy name known in the midst of my people Israel; and I will not let them pollute my holy [sacred] name any more: and the heathen shall know that I am Yahweh [#H3068], the Holy [Sacred] One in Israel.
And in very deed for this cause have I raised thee up, for to shew in thee my power; and that my name may be declared throughout all the earth.
Just a few intriguing thoughts to ponder; Because I will publish the name of Yahweh[#H3068]: ascribe ye greatness unto our 'Elohiym.
fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisra'el, NOT the STATE OF ISRAEL. |
Edited by - Oneisraelite on 24 Feb 2004 17:47:08 |
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Manuel
Advanced Member
USA
762 Posts |
Posted - 24 Feb 2004 : 19:41:36
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oneisraelite, I greet you, In Him, whom has comforted me through many struggles and tribulations, and whom has given me strength, joy, and whom has wiped tears from my eyes which at times flow with sadness, when I remember and bare the conscequences of my sins, then constantly through His Love and witnessing the sacrifice His Son left for us all as a steady keel, His seed which ever grows In me.
Maybe it is difficult for me to explain the ways I see Him, feel Him, taste Him and therefore tell you all Of Him. Yet He is tasteless, I taste Him. Yet He is odorless, I smell Him. Yet He is not visible, I see Him, yet He is silent, I hear Him and being blinded, I see Him.
When I posted these words, alone, "But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven," I did not know it would have caused so much offense.
His Grace and Light be upon you, The Messiah, Yahushuah,
I am,
Manuel
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DanielJacob
Advanced Member
USA
138 Posts |
Posted - 24 Feb 2004 : 19:49:12
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Brother oneisraelite;
Peace be unto you and your house. Let us start again with your last post. I purpose that we take one step at a time to resolve the questions that are raised in my mind. Having said that, and believing that you will concur, let me start with this:quote:
In the preface of one edition of virtually every "version" [changing] of the Scriptures that we have seen, there is the information that the sacred name has been supplanted by the generic title "the Lord". If we can agree on this one fact, then we have to ask ourselves this question: If the sacred name is not important, why did the adversary make such an all out effort to erradicate it?
Now as I see this statement, it is your position that this replacing or supplanting of the sacred name was done by and under the direction of our Adversary. This raises two questions in my mind. One: Why would our Father, YHWH, allow such a gross distortion of His Name and Word, knowing that millions would be lead astray? And; Two: What is your evidence of such an act? I ask this only because this presupposition lends itself to all other facets of this topic.
Jehovah-shalom. |
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2-elect
Occasional Poster
USA
7 Posts |
Posted - 24 Feb 2004 : 20:07:35
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quote:
Originally posted by DanielJacob
Now as I see this statement, it is your position that this replacing or supplanting of the sacred name was done by and under the direction of our Adversary. This raises two questions in my mind. One: Why would our Father, YHWH, allow such a gross distortion of His Name and Word, knowing that millions would be lead astray? And; Two: What is your evidence of such an act?
Jehovah-shalom.
Rev 12:8-9 So the great dragon was cast out, that serpent of old, called the Devil and Satan, who deceives the whole world; he was cast to the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
Rev 12:12 Therefore rejoice, O heavens, and you who dwell in them! Woe to the inhabitants of the earth and the sea! For the devil has come down to you, having great wrath, because he knows that he has a short time."
Jer 8:8 "How can you say, 'We are wise, And the law of Yahuah is with us'? Look, the false pen of the scribe certainly works falsehood.
Matt 20:15-16 "So the last will be first, and the first last. For many are called, but few chosen."
Matt 7:13-14 "Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it.
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Edited by - 2-elect on 24 Feb 2004 20:11:35 |
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DanielJacob
Advanced Member
USA
138 Posts |
Posted - 24 Feb 2004 : 20:20:55
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Brother 2-elect;
Forgive me if this is lost on me at this point. But it would appear that you are using the same presupposed corrupted scripture to quote to me about the corruption. Am I missing something, or that isn't your point?
Jehovah-shalom. |
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His name is not Yahushua
