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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
 Posted - 19 Aug 2006 : 20:39:27
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(1 Shemu'el 8 RNV) {7} And Yahuwah said to Shemu'el, "Heed the voice of the people in all that they say to you, for they have not rejected you, but [by asking for a secular king] they have rejected Me that I should not reign over them."
Luke 19:14 But his citizens hated him and sent a delegation after him saying, 'We will not have this to reign over us.'
Yahu'hanan 19:15 But they cried out, Away with him, away with him, impale him. Pilate saith unto them, Shall I impale your King? The chief priests [those presiding] answered, We have no king but Caesar.
So be it!
'Nevertheless know this, that the kingdom of Yahuwah has come near you.'
fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisar'el,
NOT the man-made, fictional USA or STATE OF ISRAEL.
Ephesians 2:12 & 19
An act done by me against my will is not my act. |
Edited by - Oneisraelite on 20 Aug 2006 09:46:07 |
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 20 Aug 2006 : 09:01:35
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F.Y.I. (For Your Information) …
We do not have in our possession the Zondervan Pictorial Encyclopedia of the Bible, 5-Volume Set; we obtained that definition, if memory serves us correctly, from Gregory’s http://www.hisholychurch.com website.
Mattith’yahu 6:24 No man can serve two masters [G2962]…
G2962
kurios
koo'-ree-os
From kuros (supremacy); supreme in authority, that is, (as noun) controller; by implication Mr. (as a respectful title) - Strong's Greek Dictionary [Emphasis added]
The nearest [that is (as a noun) English synonym, according to James Strong (italicized), for the Greek word kurios is controller.
CONTROLLER, n. 1. One who controls, or restrains; one that has the power or authority to govern or control. – Webster’s 1828 American Dictionary of the English Language
And, although some people may be controlled by mammon (the personification of wealth) or their belly (their own desires); Thayer’s Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament gives us this for the Greek word kurios.
G2962
kurios
Thayer Definition:
1) he to whom a person or thing belongs, about which he has power of deciding; master, lord
1a) the possessor and disposer of a thing
1a1) the owner; one who has control of the person, the master
1a2) in the state: the sovereign, prince, chief, the Roman emperor
1b) is a title of honour expressive of respect and reverence, with which servants greet their master
1c) this title is given to: God, the Messiah [Emphasis added]
Hence, in order not to waste the readers' time, we only gave the definition from Webster’s 1828 dictionary that appears to best coincide with what the Greek word kurios apparently means. [Note well that it does not mean mammon.]
M`ASTER, n. [L. magister, compounded of the root of magis, major, greater.] 1. A man who rules, governs… – Webster’s 1828 American Dictionary of the English Language [Note: The three little dots (...) after the word governs, directly above, means that there is more, for anyone desiring to read them all.]
Thus, by extrapolation, we see that no man can serve two masters, could have also been correctly translated no man can serve two controllers, i.e. governors or governments, including the Roman emperor.
…you readers be the judge.
We thank the readers for their time and patience.
fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisar'el,
NOT the man-made, fictional USA or STATE OF ISRAEL.
Ephesians 2:12 & 19
An act done by me against my will is not my act. |
Edited by - Oneisraelite on 20 Aug 2006 18:35:39 |
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Manuel
Advanced Member
USA
762 Posts |
Posted - 20 Aug 2006 : 14:38:30
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Greetings again to all,
There is a deep meaning to what The Right to Assemble means,
and also The Right to Seek Redress of Grievance.
Those callings and gatherings do not stop at any worldly doors,
but pierce through to a higher authority.
I am,
Manuel |
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Manuel
Advanced Member
USA
762 Posts |
Posted - 20 Aug 2006 : 23:59:19
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You see,
Why does when a man or woman dies do people gather to witness
his/her going away? Even "people" which have had previous
disagreements show up to give "respect," not only to the dead
body of the man or woman, but to the family and their love ones.
Then there is another truth. "People" spend vast amounts of time
pointing, acknowledging, and even showing off all kinds of "different"
ways and actions of others, whether they be "dare-devils," born with
deformed bodies, and even cars and other apparatus. "People" even
take the time to visit circuses to watch animals doing their tricks.
But when it comes to visiting a man or woman who is born-again, they
don't qualify unto the "category" of being seen, unless they fit unto
their pre-conditioned ideas or abandonment?
Murderers, liars, thieves etc., are given to them by those which
captivate them rights to be visited by friends and love ones, even
many which have not committed crimes under worldly captivity too are
given those rights.
The Kingdom In Father even forbids to do wrong to your neighbor.
I am,
Manuel
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 21 Aug 2006 : 06:09:58
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Greetings and salutations, brother Manuel:
Peace be unto the house.
quote:
Originally posted by Manuel
There is a deep meaning to what The Right to Assemble means, and also The Right to Seek Redress of Grievance.
Those callings and gatherings do not stop at any worldly doors, but pierce through to a higher authority.
Would you care to expand on what these deep meanings are and exactly how they pertain to entering The Kingdom of Yahuwah?
Thank you in advance for your time and effort.
fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisar'el,
NOT the man-made, fictional USA or STATE OF ISRAEL.
Ephesians 2:12 & 19
An act done by me against my will is not my act. |
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 21 Aug 2006 : 07:05:53
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Greetings once more brother:
quote:
Originally posted by Manuel
You see,
Why does when a man or woman dies do people gather to witness his/her going away?.
Because they have been taught, since birth most times, that when you die your ghost goes to another place or another dimension?
quote:
Even "people" which have had previous disagreements show up to give "respect," not only to the dead body of the man or woman, but to the family and their love ones.
Many times those who did not respect a man when he was alive, merely feign "respect" for him after he has given up his "breath". Nothwithstanding this fact, they may bring sincere condolences to those still "breathing" who will miss him.
quote:
Then there is another truth. "People" spend vast amounts of time pointing, acknowledging, and even showing off all kinds of "different" ways and actions of others, whether they be "dare-devils," born with deformed bodies, and even cars and other apparatus. "People" even take the time to visit circuses to watch animals doing their tricks. But when it comes to visiting a man or woman who is born-again, they don't qualify unto the "category" of being seen, unless they fit unto their pre-conditioned ideas or abandonment?
We apologize for not understanding the point you are trying to make here and exactly how it pertains to entering the Kingdom of Yahuwah, brother Manuel.
quote:
Murderers, liars, thieves etc., are given to them by those which captivate them rights to be visited by friends and love ones, even many which have not committed crimes under worldly captivity too are given those rights.
Unfortunately, once again we do not see, i.e. perceive, the point you are trying to make.
quote:
The Kingdom In Father even forbids to do wrong to your neighbor.
Yes, it does, brother Manuel. Yahu’shua said, "Love your brother like your soul [your "breath", i.e. your life], guard him like the pupil of your eye.”
We would like to know where the phrase, "The Kingdom In Father" comes from, if you would care to share this with us?
We thank you for your patience.
fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisar'el,
NOT the man-made, fictional USA or STATE OF ISRAEL.
Ephesians 2:12 & 19
An act done by me against my will is not my act. |
Edited by - Oneisraelite on 21 Aug 2006 07:27:56 |
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BatKol
Advanced Member
USA
735 Posts |
Posted - 21 Aug 2006 : 07:40:50
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quote:
Originally posted by oneisraelite
[font=Book Antiqua](1 Shemu'el 8 RNV) {7} And Yahuwah said to Shemu'el, "Heed the voice of the people in all that they say to you, for they have not rejected you, but [by asking for a secular king] they have rejected Me that I should not reign over them."
Aside from the fact that this passage above is in context to the dissolved Israelite kingdom and it's Old Covenant (which is NOT like the New One Jer 31:31) let's examine some other passages where Samuel instructs the people on their choice.
Later on in 1 Sam 12 we see that Samuel discusses this exact situation with the Israelites after YHWH destroys their crops in anger. Here is the bottom line. Samuel clearly instructs the Israelites that - even though they have done wrong and chosen a secular king - that they must continue and serve YHWH. Huh? How could Samuel - one who is portrayed in the scriptures as a respected Judge of the Mosaic Law and one who 'shall instruct the Israelites on the good and proper path' - make such a huge error according to what is being taught here concerning "serving two masters". If what is being taught here is correct that Samuel is in complete error with this statement below:
1Sa 12:19 And all the people said unto Samuel, Pray for thy servants unto Jehovah thy God, that we die not; for we have added unto all our sins [this] evil, to ask us a king.
1Sa 12:20 And Samuel said unto the people, Fear not; ye have indeed done all this evil; yet turn not aside from following Jehovah, but serve Jehovah with all your heart:
1Sa 12:21 and turn ye not aside; for [then would ye go] after vain things which cannot profit nor deliver, for they are vain.
1Sa 12:22 For Jehovah will not forsake his people for his great name's sake, because it hath pleased Jehovah to make you a people unto himself.
1Sa 12:23 Moreover as for me, far be it from me that I should sin against Jehovah in ceasing to pray for you: but I will instruct you in the good and the right way.
1Sa 12:24 Only fear Jehovah, and serve him in truth with all your heart; for consider how great things he hath done for you.
1Sa 12:25 But if ye shall still do wickedly, ye shall be consumed, both ye and your king.
quote:
Luke 19:14 But his citizens hated him and sent a delegation after him saying, 'We will not have this to reign over us.'
Yahu'hanan 19:15 But they cried out, Away with him, away with him, impale him. Pilate saith unto them, Shall I impale your King? The chief priests [those presiding] answered, We have no king but Caesar.
So be it!
As opposed to the ROMAN citizens such as Paul, Silus, Cornelius, proconsul Sergius Paulus who did accept Christ!
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BatKol
Advanced Member
USA
735 Posts |
Posted - 21 Aug 2006 : 08:07:28
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quote:
Originally posted by oneisraelite
[font=Comic Sans MS]F.Y.I. (For Your Information) …
We do not have in our possession the Zondervan Pictorial Encyclopedia of the Bible, 5-Volume Set; we obtained that definition, if memory serves us correctly, from Gregory’s http://www.hisholychurch.com website.
OK. So the request for the complete defintion of redemption cannot be met. This presents a few problems. The first being that this information is just being copy and pasted and not checked out completely. Secondly, how are we to know that the original author did not just select from the list of definitions the one that suited his theory? Thirdly - as a result - we are not given full disclosure on the topic of redemption.
On to Master:
quote:
Mattith’yahu 6:24 No man can serve two masters [G2962]…
G2962
kurios
koo'-ree-os
From kuros (supremacy); supreme in authority, that is, (as noun) controller; by implication Mr. (as a respectful title) - Strong's Greek Dictionary [Emphasis added]
Once again - true to form - Matthew 6:24 is being misrepresented. We are only being provided with only a fraction of the first sentence. Not even the whole verse. Here is the complete Matthew 6:24:
No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.
Now on to the definition. "Supreme in authority". That just about sums it up. You cannot have "mammon" as your "supreme authory". Fits perfectly with the whole verses.
quote:
The nearest [that is (as a noun) English synonym, according to James Strong (italicized), for the Greek word kurios is controller.
CONTROLLER, n. 1. One who controls, or restrains; one that has the power or authority to govern or control. – Webster’s 1828 American Dictionary of the English Language
And, although some people may be controlled by mammon (the personification of wealth) or their belly (their own desires); Thayer’s Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament gives us this for the Greek word kurios.
G2962
kurios
Thayer Definition:
1) he to whom a person or thing belongs, about which he has power of deciding; master, lord
1a) the possessor and disposer of a thing
1a1) the owner; one who has control of the person, the master
1a2) in the state: the sovereign, prince, chief, the Roman emperor
1b) is a title of honour expressive of respect and reverence, with which servants greet their master
1c) this title is given to: God, the Messiah [Emphasis added]
There is no conflict with the face value statement of Matthew 6:24.
Mammon cannot be your controller. Plain and simple.
quote:
Hence, in order not to waste the readers' time, we only gave the definition from Webster’s 1828 dictionary that appears to best coincide with what the Greek word kurios apparently means. [Note well that it does not mean mammon.]
I guess in order not to wast the readers time you decided only to post a fraction of the first sentence of Matt 6:24. Gee thanks.
Also - "Note well"!? LOL. Who is trying to assert that kurious means mammon?
quote:
M`ASTER, n. [L. magister, compounded of the root of magis, major, greater.] 1. A man who rules, governs… – Webster’s 1828 American Dictionary of the English Language [Note: The three little dots (...) after the word governs, directly above, means that there is more, for anyone desiring to read them all.]
Thus, by extrapolation, we see that no man can serve two masters, could have also been correctly translated no man can serve two controllers, i.e. governors or governments, including the Roman emperor. …you readers be the judge.
One could extrapolate that if one is willing to chop of the rest of the verse and engage selective quoting.
We are still left with trying to reconsile how Paul could have dual citizenship of both Heaven and ROME without conflict of 'serving two masters' according to you teaching. We are still left wondering how Joseph could be called "righteous" (defined as following divine law) while registering for the ROMAN census. This - and many other items from the Bible - do not add up if your teaching is correct. Items we don't find settled by the notion that all which disagrees with such teachings can be filed away under "lying pen of the scribes" statement about OT law.
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Edited by - BatKol on 28 Aug 2006 10:47:17 |
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2006 : 07:31:19
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And the obvious reason no man can serve Yahuwah and mammon is because ____________?
It is because of the truth of this axiom, No man can serve two masters [G2962]…
AX'IOM, n. [Etymology omitted] 1. A self evident truth, or a proposition whose truth is so evident at first sight, that no process of reasoning or demonstration can make it plainer... [Emphasis added] (Note: The three little dots [...] means that there is more, if anyone cares to look.)
No man can serve two controllers, whether the second one is mammon, his belly or the Roman emperor, if they are contrary to each other.
We ought to obey Yahuwah rather than men.
...these all do contrary to the decrees of [the] caesar, saying that there is another king, Yahu'shua... (Note: The three little dots [...] before and after this partial verse means that there are words before and after what we have posted here, if anyone cares to look.)
When thou art come unto the land which Yahuwah thy 'Elohiym giveth thee, and shalt possess it, and shalt dwell therein, and shalt say, I will set a king [one invested with authority, whether extensive or limited] over me, like as all the nations that are about me; thou shalt in any wise set him king over thee, whom Yahuwah thy 'Elohiym shall choose [by following these rules of choosing]: one from among thy brethren shalt thou set king over thee: thou mayest not set a stranger over thee, which is not thy brother. But he shall not multiply horses to himself, nor cause the people to return to mitsrayim [double straits], to the end that he should multiply horses: forasmuch as Yahuwah hath said unto you, Ye shall henceforth return no more that way. Neither shall he multiply wives to himself, that his heart turn not away: neither shall he greatly multiply to himself silver and gold. And it shall be, when he sitteth upon the throne of his kingdom, that he shall write him a copy of this law in a book out of that which is before the priests the Levites: And it shall be with him, and he shall read therein all the days of his life: that he may learn to fear Yahuwah his 'Elohiym, to keep all the words of this law and these statutes, to do them: That his heart be not lifted up above his brethren, and that he turn not aside from the commandment, to the right hand, or to the left: to the end that he may prolong his days in his kingdom, he, and his children, in the midst of Yisra'el.
brother Robert: fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisar'el,
NOT the man-made, fictional STATE OF ISRAEL.
Ephesians 2:12 & 19 |
Edited by - Oneisraelite on 23 Aug 2006 03:18:05 |
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 24 Aug 2006 : 07:59:53
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Exodus 20:1 And ‘Elohiym spake all these words, saying, 2 I am Yahuwah thy ‘Elohiym, which have brought thee out of the land of mitsrayim, out of the house of bondage. 3 Thou shalt have no other ‘elohiym before me.
There it is, the First Commandment of Yahuwah, and judging by the words of the set apart Scripture it certainly appears that one cannot possibly obey it until one has come out of double-straits (mitsrayim), i.e. out of the house of bondage.
Exodus 3:12 …Thus saith Yahuwah, Yisar’el (the prince of ‘el) is my son, even my firstborn: And I say unto thee, Let my son go, that he may serve me…
Why, because no man can serve two masters.
3 Thou shalt have no other ‘elohiym [H433] before me.
H433
‘elohiym
BDB Definition:
1) (plural)
1a) rulers, judges…
Thou shalt have no other rulers, judges before [H5921] me.
After looking at the Ibriy [Hebrew] word ‘al, which was translated “before” in the KJV, we find that this is most likely not the best English synonym in today’s language.
It literally means, “on the side with the face’, ‘in front” [of me], or in modern vernacular, above [me], in the sense of ahead of me. Or, put the way Peter and the other embassadors (apostles) understood it, we ought to obey Yahuwah rather than men.
…The Hebrew kings did not rule in their own right, nor in name of the people who had chosen them, but partly as servants and partly as representatives of Jehovah <sic>, the true King of Israel… - Easton’s 1897 Bible Dictionary
Therein lies the key. Our king does not rule in his own right, nor in the name (authority) of the people who have chosen him, rather he is our servant and the representative of Yahuwah, the true King of Yisar’el.
The phrase "the King of Yisar’el" can be translated as “the King of the princes of ‘el” and as we have previously demonstrated by way of Webster’s 1828 Dictionary, prince means “sovereign,” and princess means “female sovereign”. Thus "the King of Yisar’el is “the King of the sovereigns of ‘el”, better known as the King of kings [G935].
G935 basileus …a sovereign (abstractly, relatively or figuratively) - Strong's Greek Dictionary
And our King obeys, in the spirit in which they were given, the words of the covenant, the Ten Commandments of his, and our, Supreme Sovereign, Yahuwah. (See 1Cor. 11:3) It is not a government of, by and for the people!! It is a government of Yahuwah, overseen by His chosen King, for His people.
But, as BatKol so eloquently points out, one may freely choose to believe, or not believe, that the foregoing is the truth of the matter; there is most certainly evidence to support both sides of this debate.
...Yahuwah shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
We are reminded here of the, perhaps immortal, words of Pilate, "the sixth Roman procurator of Judah and Samaria who ordered Christ <sic> to be crucified", "What is truth?"
"The intent of this new topic is to provide information to those who would like to leave the beast system and enter the Kingdom of Yahuwah here on earth. It is not the purpose of this topic to debate whether the Kingdom is real or whether or not it is available to believers now."
This thread is dedicated to those who believe that the Kingdom of Yahuwah is here on earth, is now, and is for ever, and whose greatest desire is to enter into His Kingdom.
brother Robert: fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisar'el,
NOT the man-made, fictional STATE OF ISRAEL.
Ephesians 2:12 & 19 |
Edited by - Oneisraelite on 25 Aug 2006 07:22:57 |
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 25 Aug 2006 : 08:46:56
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...We ought to obey Yahuwah rather than men...
King - ...The Hebrew kings did not rule in their own right, nor in name of the people who had chosen them, but partly as servants and partly as representatives of Jehovah, the true King of Israel. - Easton's 1897 Dictionary of the Bible
Any man, or men, acting as the true representatives of Yahuwah, i.e. obedient to the words of the covenant, the Ten Commandments[1], we would have no trouble with; For he [ or they, would then be] the minister(s) of Yahuwah to thee for good.
Endnotes:
[1] Exodus 34:28 And he was there with Yahuwah forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he graved upon the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments.
Deuteronomy 4:13 And he declared unto you his covenant, which he commanded you to perform, even ten commandments; and he graved them upon two tables of stone.
GRAVE, v.t. pret. graved; pp. graven or graved. [Gr. to write; originally all writing was graving; Eng. to scrape.] 1. To carve or cut letters... - Webster's 1828 American Dictionary of the English Language
Remember this when encountering the modern-day "graven images" of men known as STATUTES. Statute and statue are both derived from the Latin word statuo, which means that which is set or fixed.
statue ...ETYMOLOGY: Middle English, from Old French, from Latin statua, from statuere, to set up. See statute. - The American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition. Copyright 2000
statute n. [[ME < OFr statut < LL statutum, neut. of L statutus, pp. of statuere: see STATUE]] ... - Webster's 1988 New World Dictionary of American English, Third College Edition, page 1310
brother Robert: fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisar'el,
NOT the man-made, fictional STATE OF ISRAEL.
Ephesians 2:12 & 19 |
Edited by - Oneisraelite on 25 Aug 2006 09:11:45 |
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 27 Aug 2006 : 08:41:01
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..he [Ahaziah[1]] served Baal [H1168], and worshipped him, and provoked to anger Yahuwah 'Elohiym (Ruler [2]) of Yisar'el, according to all that his father had done.
So, who or what is this Ba'al that Ahaziah served and worshipped? Strong's Hebrew and Chaldee Dictionary and Brown-Driver-Briggs' Hebrew Lexicon both tell us that H1168 is the same as H1167 and that H1167 is from H1166. Let us now proceed to BDB's complete definitions for those last two.
H1167
ba'al
BDB Definition:
1) owner, husband, lord
1a) owner
1b) a husband
1c) citizens, inhabitants
1d) rulers, lords
1e) (noun of relationship used to characterise - i.e., master of dreams)
1f) lord (used of foreign gods) [Emphsais added]
H1166
ba'al
BDB Definition:
1) to marry, rule over, possess, own
1a) (Qal)
1a1) to marry, be lord (husband) over
1a2) to rule over
1b) (Niphal) to be married [Emphasis added]
BDB tells us that H1167, ba'al, the noun masuline, means owner, husband, lord and these owners, husbands and lords, amongst other things, can be referring to rulers [and/or] lords. And when we dig deeper into its roots we find that the verb ba'al means to marry, ruler over, possess, [and/or] own.
We next go to the word worshipped [H7812], which is translated from the Ibriy [Hebrew] word shachah (pronounced shaw-khaw'). Here is what James Strong, in his Hebrew and Chaldee Dictionary, has to say concerning this word: ...to depress, that is, prostrate (especially reflexively in homage to royalty or God)
We, perhaps, need to wonder if we have, out of ignorance, married ourselves to foreign gods ('elohiym/rulers[2]) and are provoking Yahuwah to anger, as our fathers have done. We feel it is certainly something some of us might want to consider.
Endnotes:
[1] BDB Definition: Ahaziah = “Jehovah (Yahu) holds (possesses)”
[2] Brown-Driver-Briggs' Hebrew Lexicon H430 'elohiym 1) (plural) 1a) rulers, judges...
brother Robert: fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisar'el,
NOT the man-made, fictional STATE OF ISRAEL.
Ephesians 2:12 & 19 |
Edited by - Oneisraelite on 27 Aug 2006 08:43:57 |
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BatKol
Advanced Member
USA
735 Posts |
Posted - 28 Aug 2006 : 11:20:59
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quote:
Originally posted by oneisraelite
And the obvious reason no man can serve Yahuwah and mammon is because ____________?
It is because of the truth of this axiom, No man can serve two masters [G2962]…
AX'IOM, n. [Etymology omitted] 1. A self evident truth, or a proposition whose truth is so evident at first sight, that no process of reasoning or demonstration can make it plainer... [Emphasis added] (Note: The three little dots [...] means that there is more, if anyone cares to look.)
No man can serve two controllers, whether the second one is mammon, his belly or the Roman emperor, if they are contrary to each other.
If you are correct in your theory than the Bible - including many examples it gives of righteous men - is just flat wrong on so many levels.
Sure, one can extrapolate your theory if we are to completely ignore context when quoting verses, take the words of the lying Jews used to frame Christ and Apostles as truth, and then claim that anything that argues against your theory is "the lying pen of the scribes".
What you are not willing to see - and this is clearly spelled out in many examples in scripture - is the order of priorities of those called righteous, etc in the Bible show that many recognized AUTHORITY with no conflict of 'serving two masters'. Indeed, the Most High is sovereign over the kingdoms of men and gives them to anyone He wishes. The ordering of priorities shows that Joseph could still go and register for the CENSUS and still be called righteous which - as has been proven - is actually defined as 'one following divine Law'. Joseph's registering for the CENSUS - in appliciable reality - was not a breach of divine Law. Paul is another perfect example. So is Daniel, etc, etc, etc.
quote:
We ought to obey Yahuwah rather than men.
Do you know the context of which this phrase was taken from?
This was spoken by Peter in response to the Jewish high priest who commanded them not to preach Christ in the temple. The Angel of YHWH freed them from prison and instructed the apostles to preach at the temple. You have taken the above verse and recalibrated it to fit your theories while at the same time rendering many righteous figures in the Bible as unrighteous when we view them through your "halakah".
quote:
...these all do contrary to the decrees of [the] caesar, saying that there is another king, Yahu'shua... (Note: The three little dots [...] before and after this partial verse means that there are words before and after what we have posted here, if anyone cares to look.)
This is a phrase spoken by the lying Jews who were falsely accusing the Apostles. You are taking their falsehoods as truth to support your theories. Everyone should care to look and see WHO spoke the phrase quoted above, WHY it was spoken, etc.
quote:
When thou art come unto the land which Yahuwah thy 'Elohiym giveth thee, and shalt possess it, and shalt dwell therein, and shalt say, I will set a king [one invested with authority, whether extensive or limited] over me, like as all the nations that are about me; thou shalt in any wise set him king over thee, whom Yahuwah thy 'Elohiym shall choose [by following these rules of choosing]: one from among thy brethren shalt thou set king over thee: thou mayest not set a stranger over thee, which is not thy brother. But he shall not multiply horses to himself, nor cause the people to return to mitsrayim [double straits][purple], to the end that he should multiply horses: forasmuch as Yahuwah hath said unto you, Ye shall henceforth return no more that way. Neither shall he multiply wives to himself, that his heart turn not away: neither shall he greatly multiply to himself silver and gold. And it shall be, when he sitteth upon the throne of his kingdom, that he shall write him a copy of this law in a book out of that which is before the priests the Levites: And it shall be with him, and he shall read therein all the days of his life: that he may learn to fear Yahuwah his 'Elohiym, to keep all the words of this law and these statutes, to do them: That his heart be not lifted up above his brethren, and that he turn not aside from the commandment, to the right hand, or to the left: to the end that he may prolong his days in his kingdom, he, and his children, in the midst of Yisra'el.
Read the parables Christ told about the Israelites then digest these words:
Mat 21:42 Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner:
this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?
Mat 21:43 Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.
Concerning your theory:
We are still left with trying to reconsile how Paul could have dual citizenship of both Heaven and ROME without conflict of 'serving two masters' according to you teaching. We are still left wondering how Joseph could be called "righteous" (defined as following divine law) while registering for the ROMAN census. This - and many other items from the Bible - do not add up if your teaching is correct. Items we don't find settled by the notion that all which disagrees with such teachings can be filed away under "lying pen of the scribes" statement about OT law.
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Edited by - BatKol on 28 Aug 2006 11:33:55 |
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 29 Aug 2006 : 06:40:44
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BatKol:
Peace be unto the house.
I also will ask you one thing...
Do you believe that Yahushua, or whatever you wish to call the Anointed One of the New Testament, is the anointed King of the commonwealth of Yisra'el, i.e. the "Prince of the princes of 'El"?
And thou Beyth Lechem [Bethlehem], in the land of Yahudah, art not the least among the princes of Yahudah: for out of thee shall come a Governor, that shall rule my people Yisra'el. (See Miyka'yah [Micah] 5:2)
On the next day much people that were come to the feast, when they heard that Yahushua was coming to Yerushalem, Took branches of palm trees, and went forth to meet him, and cried, Hosanna: Blessed is the King of Yisra'el that cometh in the name [authority] of Yahuwah.
Do you believe Yahushua spoke the truth when he said, "All authority in Heaven and on earth was given to Me."?
brother Robert: fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisar'el,
NOT the man-made, fictional STATE OF ISRAEL.
Ephesians 2:12 & 19 |
Edited by - Oneisraelite on 31 Aug 2006 09:12:26 |
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 31 Aug 2006 : 10:58:10
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Greetings and salutations,
Peace be unto the house.
Okay, we have died a civil death, which is "equivalent in its legal consequence to natural death"[1] and now have the status of nonperson, n. UNPERSON; specif., one who is officially ignored by the government[2]. And, because we have overcome [the world], we have received a new name in a white stone, one that no man knoweth, i.e. it is a name which is not registered[3] with the STATE, (See Heb 7:3b; Rev 2:17) we never again answer to the NAME that was registered with the STATE, the "ALL-CAP FICTION", the NAME of the Artifical person created for us by the STATE at BIRTH, i.e. Persons created and devised by human laws for the purposes of society and government...[4]
Now suppose that one day we get arrested by the STATE for the heinous crime of moving about in our private conveyance [a car or a truck, not a MOTOR VEHICLE] without the CAESAR'S permission slip, a.k.a. a DRIVER'S LICENSE. Should the citizens of the Kingdom of Yahuwah fear being fingerprinted by the CAESAR'S AGENTS because they will then know who we are? Absolutely not! If they take, without our express or tacit consent[5], i.e. steal, our fingerprints, it is merely a bluff, by the STATE, to see if they can intimidate us into standing surety for a stranger, the Artifical person...created and devised by human laws for the purposes of society and government".
Why do we say it is a "bluff"? Because, scientfically speaking, that is exactly what it is!!
"Contrary to what is generally thought, there is little scientific basis for assuming that any two supposedly identical fingerprints unequivocally come from the same person. Indeed, according to a report published in December, the only major research explicitly commissioned to validate the technique is based on flawed assumptions and an incorrect use of statistics. The research has never been openly peer reviewed." - New Scientist
So after unlawfully taking our fingerprints and trying to tell us that we are the ARTIFICIAL PERSON that they created, we simply say, "That is not me", or, to state it more accurately, we can honestly say, "I am not that PERSON".
Endnotes:
[1] Webster's 1960 New Collegiate Dictionary, page 151
[2] Webster's 1988 New World Dictionary of American English, Third College Edition, page 923
[3] "...without descent[G35]..." G35 agenealogetos ...unregistered as to birth - Strong's Greek Dictionary
[4] Black's Law Dictionary, Abridged Sixth Edition, page 74
[5] TAC'IT, a. [L. tacitus, from taceo, to be silent, that is, to stop, or to close. See Tack.] Silent; implied, but not expressed. Tacit consent is consent by silence, or not interposing an objection. So we say, a tacit agreement or covenant of men to live under a particular government, when no objection or opposition is made; a tacit surrender of a part of our natural rights; a tacit reproach, &c. - Webster's 1828 American Dictionary of the English Lanugage
Our body belongs to He who created it, and as a consquence only He can Lawfully give express or tacit consent to what will be done with it, and by our manifest declaration to the contrary, He does not give His express or tacit consent. We simply state, for the record, "As it is written, we are a peculiar people, we do not consent to your stealing our fingerprints, but neither will we resist you physically from doing so, since it is also written, resist not evil. (See Mat 5:39b)
brother Robert: fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisar'el,
NOT the man-made, fictional STATE OF ISRAEL.
Ephesians 2:12 & 19 |
Edited by - Oneisraelite on 02 Sep 2006 08:48:51 |
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2006 : 08:35:19
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Greetings and salutations,
Peace be unto the house.
We bring this over from another thread here at ecclesia.org in order to expand on the concept just a bit.
Yahuhanan [John] 15:19 If ye were of the world[G2889], the world[G2889] would love his own: but because ye are not of the world[G2889], but I have chosen you out of the world[G2889], therefore the world[G2889] hateth you [Note: His was added to the phrase "his own" in the above verse; this was evidently done to promote the concept that the adversary was one single living being.]
Thayer's Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament gives us this for the Greek word kosmos [G2889] at meaning number one: 1) an apt and harmonious arrangement or constitution, order, government.
We took one of these synonyms for kosmos, specifically government, which is supposed to be the apt and harmonious arrangement, i.e. the constitution of a nation that is purportedly[1] created to keep some semblance of order within that nation, and substituted it in place of the word world in the above verse to see if it would add some light to the subject of that verse and the intended purpose of this thread.
If ye were of the government, the government would love his own: but because ye are not of the government, but I have chosen you out of the government, therefore the government hateth you.
We perceive that it does [add some light], especially when we take into consideration who it is that will persecute/prosecute[2] us simply for choosing "another king"; even if we declare, and keep that declaration, to neither intentionally or through gross negligence, do harm to any of their subjects/citizens.
When Yahushua says if you were of the worldly arrangement, i.e. the government of men, then it would love you, he is saying that it would be your Father, it would be your benefactor, it would be your god, it would give you benefits, privileges and protection. But if you are chosen to "come out of her" and choose not to be a part of its arrangement, he is saying it will hate you; it will not only not provide you with benefits, privileges and protection, it will hate [G3404] you.
G3404
miseo
Thayer Definition:
1) to hate, pursue with hatred [See [2] in Endnotes], detest
2) to be hated, detested
It will revile you, i.e. defame, that is, rail at, chide, and taunt you. Let us look at Noah's definitions for some of these words to get a feel for what the "world" might do to you for telling it that it is not your Father.
DEFAME, v.t. [[Fr. diffamer; It. diffamare; Sp. disfamar; from L. diffamo; de or dis and fama, fame. 1. To slander; falsely and maliciously to utter words respecting another which tend to injure his reputation or occupation... 2. To speak evil of; to dishonor by false reports; to calumniate; to libel; to impair reputation by acts or words.
Would the "world", by way of its AGENTS, really try to discredit you and entirely ruin your reputation simply for choosing a different Ruler? Huh? Isn't that what the New Testament calls the Devil, the Traducer? You know, the traducer, the one that is prone to calumniate; to vilify; to defame; willfully to misrepresent. Oh, my!
Would the worldly AGENTS truly rail at us just because we serve a different Master?
RAIL, v.i. [Eng. to brawl.] To utter reproaches; to scoff; to use insolent and reproachful language; to reproach or censure in opprobrious terms; followed by at or against, formerly by on.
CENSURE, n. ...2. Judicial sentence; judgment that condemns.
Is it difficult to believe that it would do such a thing?
Would the world, through its AGENTS, honestly persecute/prosecute[2] people for returning to the original estate?
PER'SECUTE, v.t. [L. persequor; per and sequor, to pursue. See Seek and Essay.] 1. In a general sense, to pursue in a manner to injure, vex or afflict; to harass with unjust punishment or penalties for supposed offenses; to inflict pain from hatred or malignity. ... 3. To harass with solicitations or importunity.
Is this possible?
SOLIC'ITOR, n. ...In America, an advocate or counselor at law, who, like the attorney general or state's attorney, prosecutes actions for the state.
Nah, can't be...can it?
Are we truly just trying to mislead everyone with all these partial definitions? We can only assure you, that on all levels of awareness, that is not our intent. As George Gordon might say, "we are only trying to connect the dots for you".
...these all do contrary to the decrees of Caesar,
saying that there is another king...
Endnotes:
[1] purport, vt. [[Etymology omitted]] 1 to profess or claim as its meaning 2 to give the appearance, often falsely, of being, intending, etc. – Webster’s 1988 New World Dictionary of American English, Third College Edition, page 1092
[2] Prosecute is merely a variant spelling of the the word persecute.
Here are Noah's etymologies for the words persecute and prosecute. See if you can find the bolded and/or underlined similarities between these two words.
PER'SECUTE, v.t. [L. persequor; per and sequor, to pursue. See Seek and Essay.]
PROS'ECUTE, v.t. [L. prosecutus, prosequor; pro and sequor, to follow; Eng. to seek. See Essay.]
According to the Online Etymology Dictionary the word prosecute is a relatively new word, which first began to be used c. 1432, and originally meant "follow up" (some course or action) or "follow after" and meaning "bring to a court of law" is first recorded 1579. Prosecutor in legal sense is attested from 1670; prosecution in this sense is from 1631.
And persecution is a "noun of action from persequi "pursue, start a legal action". "The verb persecute is attested from 1482 in the sense of "to oppress for the holding of a belief or opinion," from M.Fr. persécuter "pursue, torment, open legal action" (14c.), from L. persecutus, pp. of persequi."
This knowledge sheds new light on some verses of the set apart Scripture.
And I persecuted this way unto the death, binding and delivering into prisons both men and women.
brother Robert: fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisar'el,
NOT the man-made, fictional STATE OF ISRAEL.
Ephesians 2:12 & 19 |
Edited by - Oneisraelite on 07 Sep 2006 06:42:03 |
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 13 Sep 2006 : 07:49:35
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Greetings and salutations,
Peace be unto the house.
We bring this over from a thread entitled Statelessness.
"One could be a native American, a man born on the land of that continent, without being a citizen of any man-made STATE.
We are citizens of the commonwealth of Yisra'el, NOT the man-made, fictional STATE OF ISRAEL, yet we might also call ourselves native Americans since our place of nativity was in the place men call North America."
We believe that the following citation serves to confirm the above.
The conclusion of Elk v. Wilkins, Neb (1884), 5s.ct.41,112 U.S. 99, 28 L. Ed. 643 appears to be this, "Merely being native born within the territorial boundaries of the United States of America does not make such an inhabitant a citizen of the United States subject to the jurisdiction of the Fourteenth Amendment.".
This case can be found here: http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/getcase.pl?navby=case&court=us&vol=112&page=94
Our thanks to Gregory at http://www.hisholychurch.net/ for leading us to this pearl.
Subjectability can only occur by voluntarily consenting, although in most cases blindly, by entering into covenants (contracts) with that FEDERAL CORPORATION.
Hear, ye deaf; and look, ye blind, that ye may see.
It is the world that has been pulled over your eyes to blind you from the truth. - The Matrix
The blind [G5185] receive their sight...
G5185
tuphlos
Thayer Definition:
1) blind
2) mentally blind
G5185
tuphlos (toof-los')
Strong's Greek Dictionary Definition:
From G5187; opaque (as if smoky), that is, (by analogy) blind (physically or mentally)
This word actually comes from a root word [G5187] that means to envelop with smoke, that is, (figuratively) to inflate with self conceit
Have we had smoke blown up our keister...which only served to inflate us with self conceit? And could it be that this self conceit has caused us to be ensared? Just a thought.
You give me that juris- my diction crap, you can cram it up your ass. - LIEUTENANT to AGENT SMITH in the movie The Matrix
brother Robert: fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisar'el,
NOT the man-made, fictional STATE OF ISRAEL.
Ephesians 2:12 & 19 |
Edited by - Oneisraelite on 17 Sep 2006 07:11:00 |
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 17 Sep 2006 : 07:48:01
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Greetings and salutations,
Peace be unto the house.
So, whose "juris, my diction" are we in? Paul tells us to judge that question in this manner, "Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey..." Peter and the [other] apostles (delegates/ambassadors/commissioners) said it thusly, "We ought to obey Yahuwah rather than men". And Yahushua, the Anointed King of the commonwealth of Yisra'el (See Yahu'hanan [John] 12:13), answers our question in this fashion, "...it is written, Thou shalt worship Yahuwah thy 'Elohiym, and him only shalt thou serve". When He said this, the traducer (false accuser) had just shown Him all the realms of the world, specifically the Roman empire.
REALM, n. relm. [L. rex, king, whence regalis, royal.] 1. A royal jurisdiction or extent of government... - Webster' 1828 American Dictionary of the English Language
But we must always remember that Paul tempers his liberty with this, "All things Lawful are mine, but not all things [are] expedient (will advance Yahuwah's cause)". An ensample of this might be that although it is perfectly Lawful for us to ride our motorcycle without an helmet, it may not be expedient, i.e. beneficial for us to do so. The "rules of the road" are an other example; to disobey these would be reckless behavior [gross negligence] that would, without a doubt, eventually cause us, and others, great harm, and thus it would not be expedient to "run stop signs", fail to "yield right of way", drastically exceed designated "speed limits", etc.
brother Robert: fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisar'el,
NOT the man-made, fictional STATE OF ISRAEL.
Ephesians 2:12 & 19 |
Edited by - Oneisraelite on 17 Sep 2006 08:45:17 |
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 21 Sep 2006 : 04:54:29
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HOLIDAY. [See Holyday.] – Webster’s 1828 American Dictionary of the English Language
HOL'YDAY, n. A day set apart [holy] for commemorating some important event in history; a festival intended to celebrate some event deemed auspicious to the welfare of a nation… (Ibid.)
And Webster’s 1988 New World Dictionary of American English, Third College Edition, page 643, adds this, “4 a day set aside [holy = set apart] by law or custom for the suspension of business, usually in commemoration of some event”.
When we become citizens of the Kingdom of Yahuwah, also called the commonwealth of Yisra’el, we celebrate the holydays that are deemed, by our Supreme Suveran, Yahuwah, to be auspicious to the welfare of our nation, the house of Yisra’el.
AUSPI'CIOUS, a. [See auspice.] 1. Having omens of success, or favorable appearances… 2. Prosperous; fortunate… 3. Favorable; kind; propitious… - Webster's 1828 American Dictionary of the English Language
AU'SPICE, AU'SPICES, n. …2. Protection; favor shown; patronage; influence. In this sense the word is generally plural auspices. (Ibid.)
It also serves to show the people of the world which nation we are the Peculiar people of. For example, UNITED STATES citizens celebrate their independence from English tyranny on the 4th of July; citizens of MEXICO celebrate their independence from Spain every year at midnight on September 15th (Grito!!), and we, the fellowcitizens of the commonwealth of Yisra’el, celebrate the Pesach [Passover], which in the English should be called, Exemption Day, at midnight on the fourteenth day of Abiyb, which means, fresh, as in a fresh start.
of whom do the kings of the earth take custom or tribute? of their own children, or of strangers? Peter saith unto him, Of strangers. Yahushua saith unto him, Then are the children free [G1658].
G1658
eleutheros
el-yoo'-ther-os
Probably from the alternate of G2064; unrestrained (to go at pleasure), that is, (as a citizen) not a slave (whether freeborn or manumitted), or (generally) exempt (from obligation or liability)
Our next holyday, by the way, is on the first day of Yahuwah's seventh month, which is called in Ibriy [Hebrew], Ethaniym (permanent/enduring), and is two days from now by our reckoning. It is referred to, perhaps erringly, as the Feast of Trumpets. It may be a memorial of [the] blowing of [the] trumpets that defeated Yeriycho [Jericho] as our ancient Yisra'elite ancestors were entering Canaan. (See Yahushua [Joshua] Chapter Six) Or it may be the reflection of our New Years Day celebration which is six months earlier to the day, on the first day of the first month, Abiyb.
Nine days later, on the tenth day of Ethaniym, we celebrate the Day of Atonement (in Biblical Heb., yom kippuriym). It is the day we fully remember the treasonous (adulterous) way we have treated our Creator, the Supreme Suveran of our nation, and with this remembrance we have contrite and humble hearts, the perfect sacrifice in the eyes of Yahuwah.
Psalm 51:17 The sacrifices of 'Elohiym are a broken spirit, a broken and a contrite heart. These, O 'Elohiym, You will not despise.
Psalm 34:18 Yahuwah is near to those who have a broken heart and saves such as have a contrite spirit.
It also just happens to be a reflection of the tenth day of the first month, Abiyb, the day that our Exemption Day lamb, our "sacrificial lamb", was "put up". (See Exodus 12:3) What a coinkydink!
I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd lays down his life for the sheep.
brother Robert: fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisar'el,
NOT the man-made, fictional STATE OF ISRAEL.
Ephesians 2:12 & 19 |
Edited by - Oneisraelite on 21 Sep 2006 07:37:08 |
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 23 Sep 2006 : 10:33:11
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According to our understanding, today is the first day of Ethaniym, Yahuwah's seventh month.
Leviticus 23:24 Speak to the nation of Yisar'el, saying, In the seventh month, on the first of the month, a shabbathon (special holyday) shall be to you, a call to a memorial, a gathering of the set apart ones. You shall do no work of service (employment) and you shall bring a fire offering[1] to Yahuwah.
So we extend to all our fellowcitizens of the commonwealth of Yisar'el...
"Best Wishes for an Happy and Joyous Holyday!"
HalleluYah
Endnotes:
[1] Fireworks, in our humble opinion, might be a quite appropriate "fire offering" at this time.
brother Robert: fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisar'el,
NOT the man-made, fictional STATE OF ISRAEL.
Ephesians 2:12 & 19 |
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The Kingdom of Yahuwah
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