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NKArnold
Junior Member
USA
20 Posts |
 Posted - 06 Jun 2005 : 23:32:58
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There seems to be a great deal of argument about the name of God on this forum. The Truth is that there are several names of God. Throughout the entire old testament there are several. Yahweh being one of them writen origonaly as YHWH. Later on linguist added the vouls so that it could be pronounced. A german(I think not sure if I am quoting my history teacher correctly) linguist wanted to pronounce this but could not because of the Y and the W so he subtituded a J and V and pronounced it Jehovah. More names include Yahweh Saboath (Lord Of All the Host). He apeared to Abram as El Shaddai(Almighty God)(also translated as God of the Mountain).One of my well studdied teachers has discibed this as the closest the name of God comes to a feminine form as it can also be translated as a mother with a mountanous breast copiously giving to her child. Haggar saw him as El Roi(God of vission). I have not studied these myself yet (so please excuse the spelling) but El Gabor; Jehovah Gira(Providing God);Jehovah Nessi(Victorious God). any others that you know of or if I have mispelled or misinterperated any of these please let me know. I have only relayed what I have learned and am always open to truth any other information that you give me I will take to the Lord(english Version) and he will guid me in truth.
Thanks for reading,
Nathan |
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 09 Jun 2005 : 07:09:53
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Greetings and salutations in the name of the King, Nathan:
Peace be unto the house.
Tough question you pose... First we must determine what is a god.
GOD, n. 4. Any person or thing...honored as the chief good.
BENEFAC'TOR, n. He who confers a benefit...
So, the answer to this would depend entirely upon which government one owes his or her allegiance to for the benefits (good) and protection received.
ALLEGIANCE. The obligation of fidelity and obedience which the individual owes to the government under which he lives, or to his sovereign in return for the protection he receives. Black's 3rd Ed.
Mattith'yahu [Matthew] 6:24 No man can serve two masters (G2962)...
G2962 kurios ...supreme in authority, that is, (as noun) controller... (...a respectful title)
This word kurios was translated as God, Lord, master, [and] Sir. The Supreme Magistrate (master) of a nation is its God. So, if one is a 14th Amendment citizen, who is his Supreme Magistrate?
Magistrate, n. [L. magistratus, from magister, master; magis, major, and ster, Teutonic steora, a director; steoran, to steer; the principal director.] A public civil officer, invested with the executive government of some branch of it. In this sense, a king is the highest or first magistrate, as is the President of the United States.
If the Creator of the heaven, the earth, the seas and all that in them is was the God of that nation we would see, as the so-called "supremacy clause" (Article VI) of their constitution, something along these lines...
[2] The Ten Commandments of Yahuwâh (yod hey waw hey), and all Laws of the United States which shall be made in Pursuance therof, shall be the supreme Law of the Land; and the Judges in every State shall be bound thereby, any Thing in the Constitution or Laws of any State to the Contrary nothwithstanding.
...but we assure you, that this is not the case!!
Thus it would seem that, according to old Noah Webster, and according to the so-called "supremacy clause" of their constitution, if one was a 14th Amendment citizen his kurio's (Master's or God's) name might currently be George.
P.S. You might want to let your teacher know that (1) yod,hey, waw and aleph are semi-vowels, and not consonants, as we have been led to believe by some, and (2) that we need to take care not to confuse common names (titles) and Proper Names, i.e. Peculiar Names. And, according to virtually all sources, "Lord" is the English equivalent of Ba'al.
Name, n. 1. That by which a thing is called; the sound or combination of sounds used to express an idea, or any material substance, quality or act; an appellation attached to a thing by customary use, by which it may be vocally distinguished from other things. A name may be attached to an individual only, and is then proper or appropriate, as John, Thomas, London, Paris; or it may be attached to a species, genus, or class of things, as sheep, goat, horse, tree, animal, which are called common names, specific or generic.
Proper, a. [L. proprius, supposed to be allied to prope, near.] 1. Peculiar; naturally or essentially belonging to a person or thing; not common. That is not proper, which is common to many.
We see from the above definitions that generally speaking, your teacher is correct, the Creator has many common names, some even attached to His Proper Name, but specifically incorrect, or at the least more than a little misleading, if his/her listeners or readers consider him/her to be talking about a Proper Name. The Proper Name, yod hey waw hey, appears at least 6,000 times in the Scripture so that there could be no confusion on this point.
For some, this author included, it is extremely important to know His Proper Name, for in the Hebrew language the Proper Name contains the attributes and describes the character of He to whom it is Peculiar. Our desire to know Him on a personal level is the driving force behind our constant endeavour to know every nuance of the Proper Name of the Supreme Suveran of our nation, not for some magical incantation or superstitious (overly religious) reason, as some have falsely accused us of.
Then, of course, there are those who out of fear, or for other reasons, apparently do not care what our Father's (Founder's) Proper Name is, and claim that any common name, lord, god, father, creator, etc., will do. They say the Proper Name is not important, but we wonder, to whom is it not important?
"However, we believe that avoiding the Name of Yahuweh [sic], substituting it with a title, was the work of "the mighty one of this world" (2Cor. 4:4), in order to facilitate the introduction of the names of many a national pagan idol of the nations, to which the Glad Tidings were being brought to.
Secondly, by calling all the deities of the nations only by a title, it was very easy to assimilate them all, identifying all of them with the one deity, whichever you wish to identify them with. This is exactly what took place." - C.J. Koster, Come Out of Her My People, page 50
The choice is yours.
fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisra'el,
NOT the man-made, fictional USA.
Ephesians 2:12 & 19
An act done by me against my will is not my act. |
Edited by - Oneisraelite on 15 Jun 2005 05:20:29 |
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jun 2005 : 09:35:20
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Greetings and salutations, brother Nathan:
Peace be unto the house.
A little additional information if you are truly seeking the Proper Name of our Supreme Magistrate.
Since the Proper Name, the one inspired into The Book of the Law [bible] at least 6,000 times, seems to overshadow completely, any of the common names, let us dwell on that obvious one for a few moments.
Let us look at the first two letters of the four-letter Proper Name, i.e. yod hey. These, of course, make up the first syllable of the Proper Name. If we go to Strong’s number H3050 we find that yod hey are transliterated into the English alphabet as Yahh, they are pronounced yaw and that it is a cont. for 3068. This contraction is the first syllable of the Proper Name of the Creator, which explains why we see Yahweh (pronounced yaw-way) as opposed to Yehweh, which would presumably be pronounced yeh-way.
Contract, v.t. [L., to draw. See Draw.]
…5. To shorten by omission of a letter or syllable; as, to contract a word.
Let us now look to the last two letters which are waw hey. To rediscover, what we hope is, the correct pronunciation we go to another Hebrew word which uses these same last two letters; the Proper Name of what is commonly know as "the first woman".
Here is Dr Strong’s English transliteration of the name of the so-called “first woman”, châvvâh (chêyth waw hey), which was, and is now, mistranslated Eve in our English versions. The “c”, we are told by modern linguists, is silent so the “ch” does not have the same sound that it does in English. The waw, in the Ancient Hebrew had the vowel sound of our English semi-vowel letter, “w”, which is a quiescent (quiet) “oo” sound, as it does in the word “will”, which is technically pronounced oo-ill. It was later changed to the “v” sound, just as the “b” was still later changed to a “v” so that Ya’aqob became Ya’aqov. To his detriment, James Strong entered the picture after at least the first of these changes had taken place. We feel that he did suspect that something was amiss however; since at the letter he called a Vav (waw) he tells us it was v, or w! When we see the name of the “first woman”, which Dr Strong transliterated châvvâh, in our Webster’s New World Dictionary of American English, Third College Edition, copyright 1988, page 470 [under the word Eve] here is what we see as the etymology of that name, they tell us that it began as an Hebrew word, with the English transliteration and meaning of it being “Hawwah, lit. life, living being”; this name then mysteriously took on a “v” and evolved into Heva, which developed into Eva and finally into Eve, the name of a foreign goddess and totally alien and unrecognizable from the original! A very important side note here, is that; “In the Chickasaw language of America, a wife is called awah”, which in our humble opinion, is not an accident (coincidence), since it is the perfect transliteration of the Ancient Hebrew waw hey! Anyway, at least part of the mystery of the “v” may be accounted by the fact that “v” and “u” was once the same letter in Latin.
V is the twenty second letter of the English Alphabet… V and U were formerly the same letter, derived no doubt from the oriental vau or waw…V.R. among the Romans, stood for uti rogas, as you desire…
That red-lettered word is pronounced oo-tee, thus we can see that the letter V at one time could be pronounced as our letter U, just as Noah Webster points out here.
W is the twenty third letter of the English Alphabet. It takes its written form and its name from the union of two Vs, this being the form of the Roman capital letter which we call U. – Webster’s 1828 American Dictionary of the English Language
The reason we took you to the name of “the first woman” initially is because all we have to do now is add the yod hey Yahh pronounced yaw) to the front of this name and we have the Proper Name of our Supreme Magistrate (Remember, her name is spelled cheyth waw hey, and the Supreme Magistrate’s name is spelled yod hey waw hey), which we, and others, transliterate into English Yahuwâh, pronounced yaw-oo-ah.
Endnotes:
The side note concerning the Chickasaw’s was from James Adair (1709-1783), author of The History of the American Indians, who was “…a major player on the Anglo-Indian frontier – roughly from 1738-1768”.
There may be a very subtle, almost insignificant nuance. In “her” Proper Name transliterated to the English tongue we see two W’s, which serves to accentuate or punch the “oo” sound, while it is likely that in the name of our Supreme Magistrate that this may be quiescent; i.e. a quieter, “oo” sound. But we are here, splitting hairs, as the saying goes, since we strive for perfection.
For then will I return to the people a pure language*, that they may all call upon the name of Yahuwâh, to serve him with one consent.
And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, Yahuwâh is my 'Elohiym (Ruler).
* Some say that "name" refers to Yahuwâh's character and/or His authority and nothing more, but if this is true, why would He deem it necessary to return to the people a pure language to enable them to call upon His name?
Someone once said, "The sweetest sound a man can hear, is the sound of his own name"; wonder if that is because we are a wee bit like our Creator; a chip off the Old Block, as the saying goes?
fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisra'el,
NOT the man-made, fictional USA.
Ephesians 2:12 & 19
An act done by me against my will is not my act. |
Edited by - Oneisraelite on 21 Jun 2005 13:41:10 |
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NKArnold
Junior Member
USA
20 Posts |
Posted - 11 Jun 2005 : 10:02:38
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All that was very interesting and you both seem very well studied in the different translations. The only thing that I have seen constant in every post are the consonants YHWH.It seems imposable to get a true and exact translation. I am beginning to see why there was so much controversy on this site. This was the first time that I had seen any controversy over the name Yahweh.
I seem to get the feeling that you are apposed to using common names to address the Lord. Just to ease my mind I would like to ask if you are. Jesus instructed us in his prayer to address him as Abba, an Aramaic word (if I remember correctly), that the closest translation in English is Daddy. This is the kind of relationship God desires.
Also do you consider Elohiym(a plural form of God being the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit) and El Shaddai to be common names? I am looking forward to hearing from you again.
Thanks,
Nathan |
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 11 Jun 2005 : 11:06:41
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Greetings brother Nathan:
Peace be unto the house.
Let us begin again...here are two quotes from our first response to you...
#1
"P.S. You might want to let your teacher know that (1) yod,hey, waw and aleph are semi-vowels, and not consonants, as we have been led to believe by some..."
#2
"The choice is yours."
We simply choose to give glory unto his name the best way we know how, but others are also free to do as their studies lead them, it is not our place, nor our will, to demand that you, or anyone else, even agree with our findings, let alone adhere to them, we only give you the the things that have been given us that have led us in the direction we have taken and hope that they are helpful to you and/or others.
Prove all things, keep that which is good.
More later, if you desire, and as Yahuwâh wills.
fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisra'el,
NOT the man-made, fictional USA.
Ephesians 2:12 & 19
An act done by me against my will is not my act. |
Edited by - Oneisraelite on 11 Jun 2005 11:09:04 |
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jun 2005 : 08:14:24
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Greetings once more, Nathan:
Peace be unto the house.
You made this statement attached to a question…
“I seem to get the feeling that you are opposed to using common names to address the Lord.”
…and you deserved a stronger answer, we feel:
It does not matter one tiny little yod what we think, it is what pleases the Chief [Abba] of our Nation that is the only thing that truly matters. Would you agree?
H1 ab …3) head or founder of a household, group, family, or clan; 5) originator or patron of a class…; 6) of producer, generator (figuratively); 7) of benevolence and protection (figuratively) [benefactor]; 8) term of respect and honour; [Definition, in black, of #7 added by this author. See Luke 22:25 for the reason we have done this.]
…and finally, way down at the bottom…
9) ruler or chief (specifically) – Brown-Driver-Briggs’ Hebrew Lexicon
…a far cry from “Daddy”, in our humble opinion. But we do feel that Yahuwâh wants and deserves our “filial fear”, which as you no doubt know, is that same fear combined with love and admiration that one has, or should have, for his or her honourable earthly father. Yahuwâh does not, however, want it in the same way some men might, to feed His ego, no He wants it so that we are obedient to His Eternal Moral Law, His Ten Commandments that all men might live together in peace and harmony.
The fact that He inspired His Proper Name into His Book of the Law in excess of six thousand times indicates to us that it is very possible that His Proper Name is extremely important to Him. Would you agree?
And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name [G3686] of the Lord shall be saved. Act 2:21
For whosoever shall call upon the name [G3686] of the Lord shall be saved. Romans 10:13
G3686 onoma
Thayer Definition:
1) name: univ. of proper names
So where did the authors of Acts and Romans get this concept and what did it look like originally? For the answer to this let us to go to the book of Joel, properly Yah’el 2:32, in Jay P Green’s Literal Translation of the Bible…
For it shall be, all who shall call on the name of Jehovah [sic] shall be saved. For salvation shall be in Mount Zion, and in Jerusalem, as Jehovah [sic] has said, and among the survivors whom Jehovah [sic] shall call.
Therefore my people shall know my name: therefore they shall know in that day that I am he that doth speak: behold, it is I.
The Hebrew word translated name in these verses, and in nearly all the other eight hundred plus verses that it is used in the Old Testament, is the word shem, pronounced shame, Strong’s number H8034, and is defined in particular as, “an appellation, as a mark or memorial of individuality”. This is the precise definition of a Proper Name! Common names, i.e. names (or titles) that are common to many, are not a mark or memorial of individuality. Would you agree?
And ‘Elohiym said moreover unto Moses, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, Yahuwâh, ‘Elohiym of your fathers, the ‘Elohiym of Abraham, ‘Elohiym of Isaac, and ‘Elohiym of Jacob, hath sent me unto you: this is my name for ever, and this is my memorial unto all generations.
Thus even from this rather superficial study, we conclude that His Proper Name is indeed extremely important to Him. Would you agree?
To all those who have answered yes to our would you agree inquiries, please feel free to submit your little box of evidence,(thanks brother Judge) as we have, as to what precisely that Proper Name might be.
Thank you for you time.
fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisra'el,
NOT the man-made, fictional USA.
Ephesians 2:12 & 19
An act done by me against my will is not my act. |
Edited by - Oneisraelite on 15 Jun 2005 05:37:26 |
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David Merrill
Advanced Member
USA
1147 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jun 2005 : 06:37:50
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Dear NKArnold;
You said:
quote:
All that was very interesting and you both seem very well studied in the different translations. The only thing that I have seen constant in every post are the consonants YHWH.It seems imposable to get a true and exact translation. I am beginning to see why there was so much controversy on this site. This was the first time that I had seen any controversy over the name Yahweh.
And I am presuming that "you both" are myself and OneIsraelite. I am formerly a calibration technician and understand the importance of a proper standard, a chain of authentication and rules of evidence before fully integrating concepts into our belief sets. OneIsraelite amplifies his major points:
quote:
#1
"P.S. You might want to let your teacher know that (1) yod,hey, waw and aleph are semi-vowels, and not consonants, as we have been led to believe by some..."
#2
"The choice is yours."
We simply choose to give glory unto his name the best way we know how, but others are also free to do as their studies lead them, it is not our place, nor our will, to demand that you, or anyone else, even agree with our findings, let alone adhere to them, we only give you the the things that have been given us that have led us in the direction we have taken and hope that they are helpful to you and/or others.
I agree that there exist stamina that are quasi-vowel sounds. And these vowel sounds are crucial to properly form the 'ineffible' Name of God spoken on Yom Kippur for the atonement of Israel. It is just that Strong's, Young's and Richardson's concordance/lexicons all agree with me and one another on the topic. Whereas even the Encyclopedia Judaica and Hebrew scholar James D. Price agree that OneIsraelite's rendition of it is incorrect:
www.ecclesia.org/forum/images/suitors/Yehudah.jpg
http://www.direct.ca/trinity/yehoshua.html
http://www.aish.com/literacy/concepts/The_Pre-Messianic_Era.asp
www.ecclesia.org/forum/images/suitors/72foldName.gif
http://friends-n-family-research.info/FFR/Merrill_Pi-snippet.wmv
quote:
To all those who have answered yes to our would you agree inquiries, please feel free to submit your little box of evidence,(thanks brother Judge) as we have, as to what precisely that Proper Name might be.
The hearsay testimony offered by OneIsraelite is not substantiated by other sources. I say he has fallen for a trick that actually robs the Name of its theophoric nature - a slur upon the Name.
However you may have only glanced at the debate. There was a newcomer who was under the impression that OneIsraelite was physically writing from Israel because that is what he declared on his bio. I had a problem with that kind of falsification of credentials. In addition, OneIsraelite will change Bible quotes (or at least he used to) and would spell the Name or any substitution with his rendering of the Name. This is misquoting and that is what I was complaining about. He is entitled to believe what he wishes. In my opinion however, he is not allowed to make it look like the translators of various versions of the Holy Bible agree with him.
Regards,
David Merrill.
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Edited by - David Merrill on 15 Jun 2005 09:49:06 |
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jun 2005 : 08:15:09
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Greetings and salutations, brother Nathan:
Peace be unto the house.
Your Proper Name, Nathan (Giver) has quite a Scriptural history, does it not?!?
You asked us a two-fold question which we have yet to answer and will attempt to answer part one now.
Nathan: "Also do you consider Elohiym (a plural form of God being the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit) and El Shaddai to be common names? I am looking forward to hearing from you again."
The first thing we would like to point out is that the Hebrew word ‘elohiym has been translated God, god, gods, and goddess, among other things, but we shall start with these.
1Kings 11:33 Because that they have forsaken me, and have worshipped Ashtoreth the goddess [#H430] of the Zidonians, Chemosh the god [#H430] of the Moabites, and Milcom the god [#H430] of the children of Ammon, and have not walked in my ways, to do that which is right in mine eyes, and to keep my statutes and my judgments, as did David his father.
We see in the above verse that ‘elohiym was translated goddess (singular) once and god (singular) two times. So we can safely presume that ‘elohiym is not necessarily a plural, and definitely doesn’t mean father, son and holy spirit, at least we can certainly see that it doesn’t here, we think you’ll agree.
This is interesting because both Brown-Driver-Briggs’ Hebrew Lexicon and Strong’s Exhaustive Concordance of the Bible tell us that this word is the “plural of H433”, which is 'eloahh, they both then proceed to tell us that it is “probably prolonged (emphatically) from H410”, which is the Hebrew word ‘el which we are told is the “shortened from H352”, ‘ayil, which means, according to Dr Strong, “ specifically a chief (politically)”. An old saying comes to mind here…“oh, what tangled webs we weave”… Anyway, this matches what BDB tells us the number one meaning of 'elohiym is: "rulers, judges". Rulers and judges can be, and many times are, the same thing in the Scripture.
The important thing here is that we see too many instances to mention here that the Hebrew word ‘elohiym can apparently be singular or plural, as is the case with many words in the Hebrew language, again too many to mention here, so we give you only one glaring example (pun intended).
And God [#H430] made two great lights [#H3974]; the greater light [#H3974] to rule the day, and the lesser light [#H3974] to rule the night: he made the stars also.
We see from the above “glaring” example that the word mâorah was translated both plural and singular. (Also take note that four out of the last five words were added to the word of Yahuwâh, “for clarity” of course.) 
It is our understanding that perhaps ‘elohiym is a plurality of characteristics rather than personalities [the Catholic trinity doctrine] and that the definition of this twisting or rolling together of charactersitics may be found at Yasha’yahu [Isaiah] 33:22.
For Yahuwâh is our judge, Yahuwâh is our lawgiver, Yahuwâh is our king; he will save us.
That plurality being judge, lawgiver, king and saviour. That last one, many may jump at, but let us remind you…
Yasha’yah [Isaiah] 43:3 For I am Yahuwâh thy ‘Elohiym, the Set-Apart [Holy] One of Yisra’el, thy Saviour…
Yasha’yah [Isaiah] 43:11 I, even I, am Yahuwâh; and beside me there is no saviour.
Hosea 13:4 Yet I am Yahuwâh thy ‘Elohiym from the land of Egypt, and thou shalt know no god but me: for there is no saviour beside me.
So one might rightfully ask, then how can Yahushua be called our Saviour? Because he is. If you are drowning and I throw you a lifesaver, it is indeed the lifesaver, which saved your life, but ultimately it is I who saved you since it was I who threw it.
2Kings 13:5 (And Yahuwâh gave Yisra’el a saviour…)
Yasha’yahu [Isaiah] 41:27 The first shall say to Zion, Behold, behold them: and I will give to Jerusalem one that bringeth good tidings.
We know that Yahuwâh does not have a multiple personality disorder by these verses of the Scripture…
Then cometh the end, when he [Yahushua] shall have delivered up the kingdom to God [Yahuwâh] , even the Father [Chief] ; when he [Yahushua] shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
For he [Yahushua] must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.
For he [Yahuwâh] hath put all things under his [Yahushua’s] feet. But when he [Yahushua] saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he [Yahuwâh] is excepted, which did put all things under him [Yahushua] .
And when all things shall be subdued unto him [Yahushua] , then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him [Yahuwâh] that put all things under him, that God [Yahuwâh] may be all in all. 1Corinthians 15:24-28
After reading that last verse of the Scripture, if one still thinks that there is some sort of multiple personality, it must really be a dilly!!
Though we know that some may be greatly offended by this revelation, it was not our intent to do so; we only seek the Truth and this is what we have found.
fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisra'el,
NOT the man-made, fictional USA.
Ephesians 2:12 & 19
An act done by me against my will is not my act. |
Edited by - Oneisraelite on 15 Jun 2005 08:54:31 |
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David Merrill
Advanced Member
USA
1147 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jun 2005 : 15:17:49
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Dear NKArnold;
quote:
And I am presuming that "you both" are myself and OneIsraelite.
I apologize if you meant OneIsraelite and his wife. I just remembered he often speaks in "we".
Dear OneIsraelite;
I am not offended by your 'revelation'. I just think it is incorrect. That is why I dog you so whenever you deceptively utilize credentials of bible translators and Israel to promote it to others. As long as you are clearly stating your own opinion I have no problem with your evaluation of truth.
Regards,
David Merrill. |
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jun 2005 : 07:54:20
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Greetings and salutations, Nathan:
Peace be unto the house.
Perhaps the best way to begin to answer the second half of your question, which we perceive to be... “Is ‘El Shaddai the Proper Name of the Supreme Magistrate?” ...is with this verse of the Scripture:
Exodus 6:3 And I appeared [H7200] unto [H413] Abraham,[H85] unto [H413] Isaac, [H3327] and unto [H413] Jacob, [H3290] by the name of God [H410] ('El) Almighty, [H7706] (Shaddai) but by my name [H8034] JEHOVAH [H3068] was I not [H3808] known [H3045] to them.
Dr Strong tells us in his concordance that words without numbers and/or italicized words have been added to the Word of Yahuwâh, thus we see that the name of, which is both italicized and numberless, has been added to the above verse. While on the other hand we see shem [H8034] Yahuwâh (or however one wishes to transliterate yod hey waw hey) [H3068] at the second mention of name.
ALMI'GHTY, a. [all and mighty. See Might.] Possessing all power; omnipotent; being of unlimited might; being of boundless sufficiency; appropriately applied to the Supreme Being. – Webster’s 1828 American Dictionary of the English Language
ALMI'GHTY, n. The Omnipotent God. (Ibid.)
In view of the fact that we have already seen that that which is common to many is not proper and since we can just about guarantee that all religions and governments refer to their supreme being as the almighty, the omnipotent, the supreme [magistrate], or some other equivalent adjective that describes him as omnipotent, we can deduce that this is not the Proper Name of the Creator of the Universe, but rather a common name.
We pose a riddle for you, Nathan; if that was a statement at the end of Exodus 6:3, “but by my name was I not know to them”, them being Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, how is it that Abraham was able to do this?
And Abraham called the name of that place Iehouah-ijreh (Yahuwâh sees)… Genesis 22:14 (1611 KJV spelling)
How was he able to use a name he supposedly didn’t know? And, one more, “How was this possible…
And a son was also born to Seth, and he called his name, Enos. Then it was begun to call on the name of Jehovah [sic]. Genesis 4:26 (LITV)
…if Abraham, Isaac and Jacob didn’t know the Proper Name? We speculate that the answer to the riddle is this, “but by my Name Iehouah was I not knowen vnto them?” (1599 Geneva Bible spelling) …should have ended with a question mark, as we have taken the liberty of doing here.
We have found no reference to Yahuwâh ever referring to Himself as ‘El Shaddai, nor have we found any references where He is instructing us to call upon ‘El Shaddai, thus we have determined those to be common names.
And lastly, considering the fact that the phrase ‘El Shaddai is used, in exactly that fashion (there are two instances of Shaddai ‘El), a grand total of five times, while Yahuwâh (or however one wishes to transliterate #H3068) is used in excess of six thousand times, where would you put your money, if your were a betting man?
fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisra'el,
NOT the man-made, fictional USA.
Ephesians 2:12 & 19
An act done by me against my will is not my act. |
Edited by - Oneisraelite on 16 Jun 2005 08:16:48 |
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David Merrill
Advanced Member
USA
1147 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jun 2005 : 08:57:56
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quote:
…if Abraham, Isaac and Jacob didn’t know the Proper Name? We speculate that the answer to the riddle is this, “but by my Name Iehouah was I not knowen vnto them?” (1599 Geneva Bible spelling) …should have ended with a question mark, as we have taken the liberty of doing here.
This is what I am talking about. Exodus 6:3 of the 1599 Geneva Bible spells "JEHOVAH", not "Iehouah"; which is pronounced the same anyway. The "u" is a "w/v" type sound associated with the quasi-consonant VAW. It is not the vowel sound "u" and the "o" sound precedes the "u" anyway even in OneIsraelite's misquote.
http://bible.crosswalk.com/Commentaries/GenevaStudyBible/gen.cgi?book=ex&chapter=006
So supposing that the original 1599 actually uses the spelling quoted, the pronunciation of Jehovah is identical to Strong's, Richardson's and Young's concordances/lexicons. See for yourself, by Google "iehouah geneva". The spelling Iehouah instead of YHVH to Jehovah is questionable at best; but there is no suggestion the "o" sound is replaced by a "u" sound in the context of the hits.
quote:
The first English transcription of the Tetragrammaton appeared on the title page of William Tyndale's translation of 1525 as "IEHOUAH." Subsequent translations into English, including Miles Coverdale's (1535), the Great Bible (1539), The Geneva Bible (1560), the Bishop's Bible (1568), and the Authorized Version of 1611, also used IEHOUAH in several places, while most translations substitute the title THE LORD in place of the Tetragrammaton. Some argue that this practice reflects the Jewish tradition that it is forbidden to say the name of God. Many modern Christian translations of the Bible continue to use THE LORD (in small caps); two notable exceptions are the American Standard Version (1901) which used Jehovah throughout the text, and The Jerusalem Bible (1966) which used Yahweh similarly.
From http://yministries.com/tetragrammaton.html
But please note I did not spend a lot of time searching the hits. There are no hits that support OneIsraelite's quote above. Thus even with Geneva Bible digitizing, the spelling is out-of-vogue.
In summary do not be quick to buy that Iehouah is pronounced Yahuwah instead of Yehovah. Even if it is true that a couple translators used that spelling in Exodus 6:3 of the Geneva Bible.
Regards,
David Merrill.
P.S. This is proper quotation as I understand it:
quote:
And a son was also born to Seth, and he called his name, Enos. Then it was begun to call on the name of Jehovah [sic]. Genesis 4:26 (LITV)
The "[sic]" tells the reader that OneIsraelite believes that "Jehovah" is spelled incorrectly. Therefore just because I cannot find a hit on the oldentime spelling of the Geneva Bible does not necessarily mean the spelling is a misquote. Only that we have no access to that spelling but indirect hearsay. Since it is easy to prove by the digitized Geneva Bibles it is a misquote however, I stick by the word misquote above. That spelling has for some reason or another been abandoned.
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Edited by - David Merrill on 16 Jun 2005 09:22:15 |
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jun 2005 : 22:03:34
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Greetings and salutations brothers and sisters:
Peace be unto the house.
Just so everyone knows, we did a search for the word *Iehouah* the 1599 Geneva Bible and the 1611 King James Version on our e-Sword software. These eight verses showed up for the GB…
Genesis 22:14 And Abraham called the name of that place, Iehouah-ijreh: as it is said this day, In the mount will the Lord be seene.
DM: This is what I am talking about. Exodus 6:3 of the 1599 Geneva Bible spells "JEHOVAH", not "Iehouah"...
Exo 6:3 And I appeared vnto Abraham, to Izhak, and to Iaakob by the Name of Almightie God: but by my Name Iehouah was I not knowen vnto them.
The above is a copy and paste directly from our e-Sword software so perhaps you should not be so quick to accuse.
Exodus 15:3 The Lord is a man of warre, his Name is Iehouah.
Exodus 17:15 (And Moses builte an altar and called the name of it, Iehouah-nissi)
Exodus 23:17 These three times in the yeere shall all thy men children appeare before the Lord Iehouah.
Exodus 34:23 Thrise in a yere shall all your men children appeare before the Lord Iehouah God of Israel.
Judges 6:24 Then Gideon made an altar there vnto the Lord, and called it, Iehouah shalom: vnto this day it is in Ophrah, of the father of the Ezrites.
Psalms 83:18 That they may knowe that thou, which art called Iehouah, art alone, euen the most High ouer all the earth.
…and these four showed up for the 1611 KJV…
Genesis 22:14 And Abraham called the name of that place Iehouah-ijreh…
Exodus 17:15 And Moses built an Altar, and called the name of it IEHOUAH Nissi.
Judges 6:24 Then Gideon built an Altar there vnto the Lord, and called it Iehouah shalom: vnto this day it is yet in Ophrah, of the Abi-Ezrites.
Isaiah 26:4 Trust ye in the Lord for euer: for in the Lord Iehouah is euerlasting strength.
This last one is fascinating; the translation that came the closest is good ol’ Jay P Green’s Literal Translation of the Bible once again with this rendition of that verse:
Isaiah 26:4 Trust in Jehovah forever, for in Jah Jehovah is everlasting strength.
Anyway, suffice to say, if there is an error in the e-Sword software, we were totally unaware of it. We do not have an hard copy of the 1599 Geneva Bible so we could not cross-reference. We have confirmed that Iehouah is in the 1611 King James.
fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisra'el,
NOT the man-made, fictional USA.
Ephesians 2:12 & 19
An act done by me against my will is not my act. |
Edited by - Oneisraelite on 16 Jun 2005 22:22:47 |
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David Merrill
Advanced Member
USA
1147 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jun 2005 : 22:46:34
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quote:
The above is a copy and paste directly from our e-Sword software so perhaps you should not be so quick to accuse.
You jump to the conclusion I was accusing probably because you are conscious you are evading the point.
The point is that "Iehouah" is not pronounced like you say. It was intended by the Bible translators to be pronounced "Yehovah"; with the "v" being a hybrid of "w" and "v". You have nothing to back your assertion that it is pronounced "Yahuwah".
There is no indication that William Tyndale and Miles Coverdale had any other than Yehovah in mind when they would occasionally spell the Name Iehouah.
Regards,
David Merrill.
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Edited by - David Merrill on 16 Jun 2005 22:50:48 |
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Linc
Advanced Member
Canada
111 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jun 2005 : 23:53:56
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When will anyone here read the book by Gerard Gertoux, titled "The Name of God YeHoWaH Which is Pronounced as it is Written I_Eh_oU_Ah Its Story"
The evidence in that book is so complete, and so compelling, the Yahwists and Yehvests are left without a leg to stand on. |
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jun 2005 : 06:44:59
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Dear David Merrill:
Peace be unto the house.
Look David Merrill, if you wish to call a duck, a pigeon, go ahead, that’s your business, but to anyone with eyes to see, this is an accusation…
DM: This is what I am talking about. Exodus 6:3 of the 1599 Geneva Bible spells "JEHOVAH", not "Iehouah"...
…so you may want to do some “calibrating” on your grey matter.
Secondly, if I am ignorant for stating that the Ancient Hebrew waw is pronounced like our English double-u, I am not alone. As we pointed out earlier, to those who are functionally literate, Eve in the Scripture is cheyth waw hey. See that waw in the middle, David? Below, for your edification, are three witnesses to the modern understanding of what the closest transliteration of that letter is, in the English language, a double-u. Now pronounce the following two syllables slowly, oo-ill, and we will (oo-ill) see how the double-u got its name, from its oo or U sound.
Eve - fem. proper name, from Biblical first woman, from Heb. Hawwah, lit. "a living being." – Online Etymology – http://www.etymonline.com
Eve
ETYMOLOGY:
Late Latin Eva, Heva, from Hebrew hawwâ, living, life, from hayâ, to live; see hyw in Semitc roots. – The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition. Copyright © 2000 - http://education.yahoo.com/reference/dictionary/entry/Eve
Eve [[ME < LL(Ec) Eva, Heva < Heb Hawwah lit. life, living being]] – Webster’s New World Dictionary of American English, Third College Edition, copyright 1988-1996, (page 471 in the 1988 edition).
So, as you can see it may be you who are “evading the point”; so, as everyone can see this is yet another false accusation from you.
Thank you for your time.
fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisra'el,
NOT the man-made, fictional USA.
Ephesians 2:12 & 19
An act done by me against my will is not my act. |
Edited by - Oneisraelite on 21 Jun 2005 07:40:51 |
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David Merrill
Advanced Member
USA
1147 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jun 2005 : 11:08:37
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It is easy to see that you misquoted the Geneva Bible. If you link to the Geneva Bible you are citing it is spelled "Jehovah". Readers; just click on http://bible.crosswalk.com/Commentaries/GenevaStudyBible/gen.cgi?book=ex&chapter=006 and see for yourself. But that accusation is so old and I really did not want to rehash that. It is the reason this Topic was started basically; because OneIsraelite likes to misquote popular Bible translators to make it look like the proper way to say the Name is Yahuway. I explain my personal history with that pronunciation and why it is such misdirection on other Topics already.
Finally OneIsraelite has come back to this forum and he finally explained some things that he would not before. He is claiming that William Tyndale and Miles Coverdale in using the spelling Iehouah were thinking his pronunciation Yehuway and trying to tell us that verifies his deviation in the pronunciation is valid.
quote:
Secondly, if I am ignorant for stating that the Ancient Hebrew waw is pronounced like our English double-u, I am not alone. As we pointed out earlier, to those who are functionally literate, Eve in the Scripture is hey waw hey. See that waw in the middle, David? Below, for your edification, are three witnesses to the modern understanding of what the closest transliteration of that letter is, in the English language, a double-u. Now pronounce the following two syllables slowly, oo-ill, and we will (oo-ill) see how the double-u got its name.
I always assumed that the "double-u" (however it is spelled out) came from the shape. So I do not buy into OneIsraelite's assumption. However if I did it would support my contention that the Iehouah spelling is pronounced Yehovah. And it agrees with the book title:
quote:
When will anyone here read the book by Gerard Gertoux, titled "The Name of God YeHoWaH Which is Pronounced as it is Written I_Eh_oU_Ah Its Story"
Thank you, Link.
It seems if the Name of God is so important to OneIsraelite he would analyze it in light of the facts.
Regards,
David Merrill.
P.S. Link. The treatise clearly leads the reader to believe the Iehouah spelling is from the Greeks trying to imitate the Hebrew. So they probably got the vowel sounds correct. But where did you get the "I_Eh_oU_Ah" from? Is that the title of the treatise?
http://gertoux.online.fr/divinename/exceptional/documents.htm
quote:
For example, an erudite theologian, Cardinal Nicholas of Cusa (1401-1464), in his sermon entitled In principio erat verbum (In the beginning was the Word), written around 1428, he explained, based on rabbi Moyses's works, the various names of God (Adonai, Jah, Sabaoth, Schaddai, etc.) and the meaning of the Tetragram, which he vocalized Iehoua (Nicolai de Cusa - Opera omnia. Sermo I In principio erat verbum Hamburg 1970 Ed.
And moreso supporting the "o" sound after the "Yeh"; and that the "u" sound is a "w/v" sound (soft "v" or hard "w") is the quote at the bottom of the snippet:
quote:
Thus, Sébastien Chateillon constantly used the name Ioua in his Latin translation of the Bible (1551) then in his French translation (1555). Antoine Fabre d'Olivet used Ihôah in his French translation of the Book of Genesis (1823) and Johann Babor sometimes used Ihoua in his German translation of the New Testament (1805).
P.P.S.
Link; I found it by search engine.
http://www.muslim-names.co.uk/namebooks/free.php?in=ca&asin=0761822046
And looks like what was meant by the author was to emphasize the "O" not the "U". Click the above link and here is the Google hit exactly as found:
quote:
The Name of God Y.Eh.Ow.Ah Which Is Pronounced As It Is Written ...
Current Amazon Canada particular-edition data for 'The Name of God Y.Eh.Ow.Ah Which
Is Pronounced As It Is Written I_Eh_Ou_Ah: Its Story' by Gerard Gertoux.
And from the book advertizement:
quote:
The Name of God Y.Eh.Ow.Ah Which Is Pronounced As It Is Written I_Eh_Ou_Ah: Its Story
So I suspect the book advertizer spelled it incorrectly when placing the banner on the ad.
I am going shopping for that book Link. Thanks again. - - Hey! Ouch! $47.
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Edited by - David Merrill on 17 Jun 2005 16:53:16 |
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jun 2005 : 20:14:40
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Why do I waste my time communicating rationally with you. Go download the e-Sword here: http://www.e-sword.net Then download its 1599 Geneva Bible software and verify that what we have posted is what is there, word for word, and then come back here and apologize for your False Accusations.
If anyone here at ecclesia.org has the e-Sword software and cares to assure this Accuser that we are indeed copying and pasting that verse unedited from its 1599 Geneva Bible software, you are more than welcome to do so. Thank you for your time and assistance in this matter.
quote:
1599 Geneva Bible
With
Original Footnotes
and Corrected Spelling
Not to be confused with "The 1599 Geneva Study Bible" on www.Crosswalk.com which is not even a Geneva translation. -http://www.genevabible.org/Geneva.html [Emphasis added]
The 1599 Geneva Bible and The 1599 Geneva Study Bible are not the same; in fact it would appear as though The 1599 Geneva Study Bible isn't even a Geneva translation!! Unfortunately neither is a 1599 Geneva Bible...with Corrected Spelling.
fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisra'el,
NOT the man-made, fictional USA.
Ephesians 2:12 & 19
An act done by me against my will is not my act. |
Edited by - Oneisraelite on 17 Jun 2005 21:57:08 |
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David Merrill
Advanced Member
USA
1147 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jun 2005 : 00:08:40
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Quoting you:
quote:
And Abraham called the name of that place Iehouah-ijreh (Yahuwâh sees)… Genesis 22:14 (1611 KJV spelling)
You insist that Iehouah is pronounced Yahuwah. That is the point I have been making. Obviously I have not been contesting that there have been some spellings of the name Yehovah by the Greek direct equivalent Iehouah.
For one thing you are calling the Bible you quoted the "1599" Geneva Bible and that is the Geneva Study Bible as I understand it now from your Post. So you misquoted. Then you insist on an apology by sending me to a link to the "1587" Geneva Bible; the only Geneva Bible on the Page. http://www.e-sword.net/bibles.html
If you are going to quote obscure Bibles that are difficult to read because the spellings of words are long fallen out of use, then you better be linking them directly yourself - in the original quotation. Whether by mistake or not, you led me into the accusation and therefore my apology is retiscent and stipulating the above. Because if you made an honest mistake about the year that directed me to the accusation, then you should apologize. If you did it intentionally for debate leverage and I find out so, then that is our last debate OneIsraelite.
I feel you still avoid the issue. Iehouah is pronounced "Yehovah" and was intended so by the original translators who spelled it that way. Not "Yahuway". There is plenty of evidence behind my claim and you have failed to bring any forth about your pronunciation.
Thank you for the link to e-sword. That software looks promising. I will likely convert and load up on a few Bible translations.
Regards,
David Merrill.
P.S. For the record, OneIsraelite said:
quote:
If anyone here at ecclesia.org has the e-Sword software and cares to assure this Accuser that we are indeed copying and pasting that verse unedited from its 1599 Geneva Bible software, you are more than welcome to do so. Thank you for your time and assistance in this matter.
When there is no such Bible on e-sword.
Up until now, and only because of this misdirection this time, every accusation about misquoting the Bible on this forum has been correct. So it is no surprise that OneIsraelite casts the aspersion "Accuser" upon me. I have convicted him several times of this intentional misquoting Bible translators. |
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jun 2005 : 10:11:54
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Dear David Merrill:
Peace be unto the house.
Let us get the facts in order.
(1) It is you who misquoted!! You posted the link to The 1599 Geneva Study Bible…
quote:
It is easy to see that you misquoted the Geneva Bible. If you link to the Geneva Bible you are citing it is spelled "Jehovah". Readers; just click on http://bible.crosswalk.com/Commentaries/GenevaStudyBible/gen.cgi?book=ex&chapter=006 and see for yourself. – Posted - Jun 17 2005 : 11:08:37 AM - by David Merrill
…which is evidently not even a Geneva translation! If we were as blunt, unkind, and unthinking as yourself, we could probably call you a Liar, since that is Not the Bible we were quoting, but we instead will be more thoughtful and simply say that perhaps you are senile.
(2) We downloaded our e-Sword about three years ago and have what it self-describes as a 1599 Geneva Bible. We obviously did not know that brother Rick, the creator of e-Sword, now evidently offers the Geneva Bible, 1587 (with Apocrypha) in place of the 1599 Geneva Bible. Since the only one he evidently now offers is the 1587 version with Apocrypha this cannot be the one we have, since ours does not have an apocrypha and, as we said, self-describes itself as the 1599 Geneva Bible. If this is not truth then you will have to take it up with brother Rick Meyers, the creator of e-Sword.
(3) We copied and pasted Exodus 6:3 from our self-described 1599 Geneva Bible without editing the Proper Name in any way and do it once more herewith.
Exo 6:3 And I appeared vnto Abraham, to Izhak, and to Iaakob by the Name of Almightie God: but by my Name Iehouah was I not knowen vnto them.
Thus you have made a False Accusation when you said, “So you misquoted.” Again, if we were as rude and as insensitive as yourself, we would say that you are a Liar, but we will instead simply say that perhaps you have misspoken.
(4) Here we feel, you Intentionally misquote us, as you have so many times before, we have simply lost count.
quote:
I feel you still avoid the issue. Iehouah is pronounced "Yehovah" and was intended so by the original translators who spelled it that way. Not "Yahuway".
To the best of our knowledge and recollection we have Never used “Yahuway” as you have stated over and over again in your posts, thus again, if we were like you we would make wild accusations against you and call you a Liar, but we will be kind and simply say you are in error, and ask you to produce the evidence for the members of ecclesia.org that we have ever used that variation of the Proper Name of the Creator.
(5) And yet again, if we were as calloused as yourself we would simply call you a Liar once more for this statement made by you…
quote:
There is plenty of evidence behind my claim and you have failed to bring any forth about your pronunciation. [Emphasis added]
…since, even a blind man (figurativly speaking) can see that we have indeed produced evidence about the pronunciation we use, however, in kindness we will just presume that you are functionally illiterate.
(6) I cast the aspersion of Accuser on you because, you are, and it should be evident to everyone here including that figurative “blind man” we mentioned above. It is our opinion that you simply love to argue (debate).
(7) With all this being clarified we now post this pompous statement made by you…
quote:
If you did it intentionally for debate leverage and I find out so, then that is our last debate OneIsraelite.
…and say, let us save you the effort of any more vain threats…Yahuwâh willing, this is our last debate with the person called David Merrill. They are, as nearly always, distracting, pointless and unending and do nothing to enhance the topic at hand.
fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisra'el,
NOT the man-made, fictional USA.
Ephesians 2:12 & 19
An act done by me against my will is not my act. |
Edited by - Oneisraelite on 18 Jun 2005 11:00:20 |
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David Merrill
Advanced Member
USA
1147 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jun 2005 : 11:04:09
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This is the topic at hand. The argument over how to pronounce the Name of God.
It is pronounced Yahovah. In English transliteration it should be understood that the "J" is silent and never existed in the Hebrew or Aramaic alphabets. The "V" should be pronounced as a hard "W" sound. But the major point is that the "O" vowel after the yod and hey is a long "O" sound, not a "U" sound as you will have us believe. You nitpick at tangents when you profess I misquoted you by spelling your version Yahuwah as Yahuway. I stand corrected on that point. It is not a typo so much as another common mispronunciation of the Name. I got your error mixed up with another error.
quote:
If anyone here at ecclesia.org has the e-Sword software and cares to assure this Accuser that we are indeed copying and pasting that verse unedited from its 1599 Geneva Bible software, you are more than welcome to do so. Thank you for your time and assistance in this matter.
Sure. If anyone can show that e-sword has had the 1599 Geneva Bible OneIsraelite is talking about available in the past, I consider that germane to the argument. Meanwhile since you refuse to apologize for your mistake I will presume that the misdirection to the Geneva Study Bible was intentional sophistry. And I admit very clever at that.
For if you would have said you were quoting the 1587 Geneva Bible then I probably would have hit on it. Better yet, if you would have just provided the link to e-sword so that I could verify for myself, then that would have circumvented the accusation. But you said "1599" and now expect that I would know the Geneva Bible and the Geneva Study Bible are completely different bibles? This is why I am quickly convinced you have invented a way to argue, while being technically correct about my accusation.
Now here is what really gets me about you OneIsraelite:
quote:
From the 1587 Geneva Bible
Exo 6:3 And I appeared vnto Abraha, to Izhak, & to Iaakob by the Name of Almightie God: but by my Name Iehouah was I not knowen vnto the.
Look at the differences in "V" and "U" and "W" and "J" and apparent lack of the letter "M". You have no business citing such an archaic work without giving us direct link to validate the context. http://www.e-sword.net/bibles.html
See how easy that is? So any conditional apology from me would stand upon your either apologizing for stating the wrong date or proving that e-sword has ever distributed such a 1599 Geneva Bible. For now I am convinced it is the same intent to misquote and persuade readers about your incorrect pronunciation; albeit you cleverly used technical misdirection to do it this time.
Also you should provide some kind of evidence that "Iehouah" used in the Geneva Bible and other places is to be pronounced your way instead of the way everybody else pronounces it.
Better yet. Back to my original inquiry. Exactly how, where, when and through what ministers or doctrine did you come to believe that the Name is Yahuwah instead of Yehovah? You will not explain that in simple terms. And why do you feel it is so important, even to be disruptive, to teach it to others?
Regards,
David Merrill.
P.S. My assertion about these misquotes being true convictions against OneIsraelite in the past is based on him changing the names in the LITV Bible. Just one example: http://www.ecclesia.org/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=88&whichpage=4&SearchTerms=litv%2Coneisraelite%2Cdavid%2Cmerrill
quote:
Oneisraelite said:
quote:
Yirm'yahu 8:8(LITV) How do you say, We are wise, and the Law of Yahuwah is with us? Behold, the lying pen of the scribes has certainly worked deceit.
And I quoted in correction:
quote:
Jer 8:8 How do ye say, We are wise, and the law of the Lord is with us? Lo, certainly in vain made he it; the pen of the scribes is in vain. KJV
quote:
What are the initials LITV for? And does it really say "Yahuway" instead of "LORD" or some other reference to God?
After being evasive and if I remember some prodding in PMs, OneIsraelite answered the Literal Bible and I was able to find the passage:
quote:
8 How do you say, We are wise, and the Law of Jehovah is with us? Behold, the lying pen of the scribes has certainly worked deceit.
So it is clear OneIsraelite misquoted the LITV translators by changing "Jehovah" to "Yahuwah". And the passage he altered is eloquently ironic.
P.P.S. From another site:
quote:
OneIsraelite said:
For he/she is not an Yisra’elite that is one outwardly, nor is circumcision that outwardly in flesh; but he/she is an Yisra’elite that is one inwardly, and circumcision is of heart, in spirit, not in letter; of whom the praise is not from men, but from Yahuwâh. (the brother Robert: translation of Romans 2:28-29)
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Edited by - David Merrill on 19 Jun 2005 17:43:53 |
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Oneisraelite
Advanced Member
uSA
833 Posts |
Posted - 21 Jun 2005 : 08:06:50
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Greetings and salutations, brothers and sisters:
Peace be unto the house.
We wish to make public an error, which has now been corrected, in our Jun 10 2005 : 09:35:20 AM & Jun 17 2005 : 06:44:59 AM posts on this thread; we spelled the Hebrew name of the “first woman”, hey waw hey and that is incorrect, it should have read chêyth waw hey. The only good news in this is that it detracts in no way from the point that we were trying to make, which of course was that the sound of the Ancient Hebrew waw is the same as our semi-vowel W, i.e. an oo sound similar to our U, as in flu.
We apologize for the error but it certainly does serve to verify why Shaul/Paul said we should “prove all things; hold fast that which is good”.
We thank you in advance for your kind understanding.
Sincerely,
brother Robert:
fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisra'el,
NOT the man-made, fictional USA.
Ephesians 2:12 & 19
An act done by me against my will is not my act. |
Edited by - Oneisraelite on 21 Jun 2005 08:20:28 |
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The Name Of God
