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 What is the "free-est" state to live in?
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sambo1011
Occasional Poster

USA
10 Posts

Posted - 24 Aug 2002 :  02:27:52  Show Profile  Visit sambo1011's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Does anyone have any information about which areas are Gestapo-lite?

That is, areas that don't seem to require Marriage Licences and Birth Certificates, etc. to exist?



doer
Advanced Member

uSA
198 Posts

Posted - 24 Aug 2002 :  17:52:39  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
There really are no "Gestapo-Lite" areas anymore. The only ones that I would live in, are Nye county in Nevada (if you do not mind 120 degree heat), the Idaho panhandle, northeastern Washington State, and eastern Oregon. The Dakotas and remote parts of Montana might also work. Texas has the reputation of a "lone star," but is now too populated and too much influenced by the "immigrants" from the northern industrial states and Mexico. The areas mentioned do not offer any additional "freedoms," but rather the opportunity to commune with like-minded Souls who tend to aggregate there.

At all costs, keep far, far away from metropolitan areas, the northeast (and east of the Mississippi River in general), and all of California. Oregon is a case study of what happens when liberals take over. Year after year, the vast majority of its counties vote conservatively. Year after year, Portland's sheer size and liberalism overrules these votes with liberal federal and state politicians.

The very BEST way to get around the "Gestapo" Government, is to understand its strengths and weaknesses, to KNOW THE LAW (the REAL Law -- not just Statutes), and thereby to use guerilla tactics to frustrate its attempts at controlling you.

Be Well,
George
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rdm
Regular Member

USA
26 Posts

Posted - 28 Aug 2002 :  13:58:05  Show Profile  Visit rdm's Homepage  Send rdm a Yahoo! Message  Reply with Quote
There is a group of families living in Southern Missouri who don't have any of Caesar's papers, marks, numbers, etc. They do rather well.

Office of the Overseer for the Popular Assembly of Redemptive Dominion Missions, a corporation sole, and his successors.
http://www.angelfire.com/sd2/rdm
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doer
Advanced Member

uSA
198 Posts

Posted - 28 Aug 2002 :  16:48:39  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Yes, there are "groups" all over the country, who have little to do with Caesar. The Amish in Pennsylvania are the most notable. Then there are the Quakers, a few of the Mormons, and others less notable.

But as to a whole STATE -- "there is no such animal." Therefore we must create our own "State" apart from Caesar. It begins with our "State of Mind."

Be Well,
George

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DanielJacob
Advanced Member

USA
138 Posts

Posted - 29 Aug 2002 :  23:55:56  Show Profile  Visit DanielJacob's Homepage  Reply with Quote
The Amish, Quakers, and Mormons are very much involved with Caesar. They all have SSNs and bank accounts. The Mormon church is a 501(C)(3) corporation. Having the SSN was the problem in the UNITED STATES v. LEE 455 U.S. 252 (1982) & WISCONSIN v. YODER 406 U.S. 205 (1972). If they had not had the SSN and had not partaken of the benefits of the STATE, then the courts would not have had jurisdiction in these cases. Like most everyone else, these groups as others, give life to the image of beast by joining themselves to it.

Peace brothers....

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Shiloh
Senior Member

USA
69 Posts

Posted - 30 Aug 2002 :  03:43:03  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
again one must ask, once a number has been assigned (say to a nine year old) how does one revoke the SSN of the Beast? Many people have tried to revoke the number, but I have never heard of one successful case.




One "unlucky 9 year old",

Shiloh
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DanielJacob
Advanced Member

USA
138 Posts

Posted - 30 Aug 2002 :  09:20:35  Show Profile  Visit DanielJacob's Homepage  Reply with Quote
It is not so much that the number has been assigned as the use of the number. This is what gives it life, just as acceptance/acknowledgment give life to the dead words on paper of constitutions, codes, rules, regulations, etc. None of these images have life until men give them life. Just don't use the number or acknowledge that it is yours.

Peace to all....

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doer
Advanced Member

uSA
198 Posts

Posted - 30 Aug 2002 :  20:24:55  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Then again, THE NUMBER is quite useful. I, for one, do not see any sin in using it for Our Creator's purpose. Part of that purpose is to engage in commerce between other people, in order to provide sustenance for ourselves and our family. It is better NOT to use it, but that may take some time to realize. In the meanwhile, we must live and work toward that goal of independence -- being dependent only on Our Creator for the Light.

So there is a way to use Caesar's Number and other tools of The Abominable System. But we must be very conscious of falling into their trap of co-dependence. To that end, there are legal means to accomplish an "arms-length" arrangement.

Be Well,
George
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Bondservant
Forum Administrator

381 Posts

Posted - 30 Aug 2002 :  20:36:12  Show Profile  Visit Bondservant's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by doer: So there is a way to use Caesar's Number and other tools of The Abominable System. But we must be very conscious of falling into their trap of co-dependence. To that end, there are legal means to accomplish an "arms-length" arrangement.


Please allow me to re-phrase what you were headed towards by saying this: We must be very careful to not cross the line between His Kingdom and the kingdoms of this world. To be in this world, but not OF it, we must make sure we do not accept or act upon the "benefits" afforded to their marks and numbers of worldly identification.

I hope I've "transliterated" your point properly. If not, then let it be my own statement as a bondservant within His Spiritual Body.
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doer
Advanced Member

uSA
198 Posts

Posted - 31 Aug 2002 :  01:30:30  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
The BIG QUESTION is -- how far do we go with this? To do as you say, would mean to reject ANY ANd ALL "numbers." This would include driver's license, any form of government or corporate employment (and most small business employment -- since most employers ask for SSN), car registration and insurance, mail delivered to any address [number], bank accounts, credit cards (gee, those are sure handy!), telephone numbers (we don't want to be supporting Caesar with those excise taxes now, do we?), etc., etc.

In fact, a strong case can be made, that we do NO COMMERCIAL ACTIVITY WHATSOEVER -- since the taxes from this only goes to make Caesar stronger. There are SEVERAL DOZEN "hidden" taxes on one loaf of bread, so imagine how much we support The System by buying ANYTHING.

What is IMPORTANT here, is to FOLLOW THE SPIRIT of the teaching. We can do ANYTHING -- so long as it is not for our ego benefit -- but as a SACRAMENT (sacred sacrifice) to Our Creator. Surely He did not create us and put us in our present situation, expecting that we should immediately "walk on water," call manna from heaven for our sustenance, and live only on Spirit!

We are imperfect creatures, and our own eartly fathers had the task of patiently guiding us in the Ways of The World -- so that we could some day become independent and live on our own. How much more patient and understanding is Our Heavenly Father -- guiding us back to Paradise, teaching our Souls the art of discernment -- so that we can recognize the Truth from the Falsehood.

THE SYSTEM is here for our learning and therefore our benefit. It is the NECESSARY CONTRAST to the TRUE GOVERNMENT. In order to transcend it, we must first become involved with it. We need to learn to use it without being DEPENDENT upon it -- reserving our dependence on Our Creator alone. DEPENDENCE = ALLEGIANCE.

In transcending The System, we learn INDEPENDENCE, and we are then able to teach others by example, how to become independent. Thereby we frustrate The Great Deceiver while using his own System against him. THE NUMBER is evil only if we NEED it to survive. But if we are truly INDEPENDENT, then we can take The System or leave it. We can use it without its having a hold on us. WE CAN HAVE A DRIVER'S LICENSE!

Be Well,
George
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sambo1011
Occasional Poster

USA
10 Posts

Posted - 07 Sep 2002 :  12:11:13  Show Profile  Visit sambo1011's Homepage  Reply with Quote
But how does a woman get a Driver License once she has been married. I think we would all agree that a Marriage licence is not acceptable. But DMV will not change a womans name on a DL without an ML. Open to any suggestions.

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DanielJacob
Advanced Member

USA
138 Posts

Posted - 07 Sep 2002 :  14:49:06  Show Profile  Visit DanielJacob's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Now the question becomes: What is the concern with a marriage license if you are going to apply for a driver's license? They are both license's, providing jurisdiction to the State.

Peace to all....

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tykayjr2000
New Member

USA
1 Posts

Posted - 07 Sep 2002 :  15:52:42  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Daniel
Go to tbafoundation.com they could help you!
Tom

Tom Kelley
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Bondservant
Forum Administrator

381 Posts

Posted - 07 Sep 2002 :  17:13:19  Show Profile  Visit Bondservant's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Go to tbafoundation.com they could help you! Tom


Daniel Jacob has read the hundreds of articles on this site, so I see little need for him or anyone else to go to a site with 'patriot' articles that mimic what we have posted here. Our articles are based on the Law of God, the Lawgiver, but from what I just read, the site you recommended is based on something else.
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doer
Advanced Member

uSA
198 Posts

Posted - 08 Sep 2002 :  20:23:41  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Posted by Sambo1011: But how does a woman get a Driver License once she has been married. I think we would all agree that a Marriage licence is not acceptable. But DMV will not change a womans name on a DL without an ML. Open to any suggestions.


Not true. I once changed my name using the Common Law method, then got a library card, voter registration and new SS card. Those were then used to get the DL.

However, since that time 15 years ago, I have changed my views considerably, and would not go through that process again. You could (should?) do it, though, just to "get acquainted" with Caesar's System. You see, Caesar recognized Common Law, though his minions will do everything in their power to confuse you and disuade you from standing up for your rights.

Driving is a PRIVILEGE. Why is it a privilege? After all, we have the RIGHT to use "the common ways," using the mode of transportation of the day. In the old days, that was horse and buggy; today it is train and automobile. Driving is a pivilege because WHEN YOU SIGN on the dotted line, YOU GIVE UP YOUR RIGHT in exchange for the privilege. You give up your freedom in exchange for regulation.

Same thing with car titles. THERE IS NO LAW REQUIRING you to register your car. You get the TITLE to the new car from the manufacturer. So why do you then turn over that TITLE to the State, in exchange for a CERTIFICATE OF TITLE -- certifying that the State now has the title, and that you have exchanged your FREEDOM of operating that car for the PRIVILEGE of renting it from the State. The rent is the yearly "registration fee," of course. EVERY SINGLE STATE has this same Satanic System, and ALL "titles" from the State will ALWAYS have some such phrase as "Certificate" at the top of the document. If it is the REAL TITLE why cannot they just call it that? There is a reason.

Same thing with land titles. That is why the State can seize your property -- because YOU have "voluntarily" given it to them WHEN YOU SIGN.

Keep researching. Keep learning. The answers will come to you if you only SEEK them heartily. This attitude will prepare your mind to receive The Light when it is ready to be shown. Like a radio receiver, you must "tune in" to that special "frequency" that answers your greatest desire.

Be Well,
George
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sambo1011
Occasional Poster

USA
10 Posts

Posted - 09 Sep 2002 :  00:09:53  Show Profile  Visit sambo1011's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Ok this is starting to get somewhere. The Question was raised why worry about Marriage License and not the DL. Well, the for the DL we have been in the system a long time, we already signed that away at 16 when we knew nothing, I don't really know if one can really get out. And in all truth, do I really want my wife taken off to jail with a gun to her head and who knows what happens to the children, all because I want to claim my right to use the road? Life is short and I do not know how to win that battle. I would rather spend the time fishing for souls.

However, the marriage license is something I can do to try to protect my children and attempt to keep them out of the system. I would think it is a lot easier to keep out than get out. Although I do not know how to get them out of the hospital without the birth certificate.

Now 15 years ago you might have been able to change a name on DL using a library card, voter registration or SS card, but all DMV will takes now is a Court order or Marriage License. We have tried in Cal, and Wash, and I have called other State's DMVs and asked.

I have been reading everything I can fing on this for 3 years now. I have read all the stuff on this site, and I can't find the answers. Biblical concept I get. Actions to take, I don't get. So I could use some direction. Please.

I am also very intrested how those of you manage to buy or sell anything with out a DL. And how do manage to stay out of jail when the police pull you over.

But, more to the point is how can I get her name changed on her DL without a ML.
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DanielJacob
Advanced Member

USA
138 Posts

Posted - 09 Sep 2002 :  18:44:35  Show Profile  Visit DanielJacob's Homepage  Reply with Quote
sambo1011,

quote:
I don't really know if one can really get out. And in all truth, do I really want my wife taken off to jail with a gun to her head and who knows what happens to the children, all because I want to claim my right to use the road?


One can get out. I have been out for over five years. No DL, registration, banking accounts, etc. It can be done, BUT, I am not going to tell you that it is easy. The point you make here is very important. The primary question that you must answer for yourself is this: Why am I doing what I am doing? Is it because it is something that you want, or is it something that our Master, the Christ, has put on your heart? Without answering that question in the latter, stop trying. You canít do this without the Christ having written it on your heart. Further, not only would you have to be able to make the appropriate arguments when encounters occur, and they will, but your wife would also need to be just as convicted to this path unless she is not called to this. It must be written on her heart also.

quote:
Although I do not know how to get them out of the hospital without the birth certificate.


One of the brothers that I fellowship with, his wife gave birth about seven months ago. Now this brother does not have a DL, registration, bank account, insurance, does not use the SSN and does not answer to the NAME that man has given him. Now this is very important, when they asked him for a name for the baby he told them that he hadnít given her one. He walked out of the hospital with his wife and the fruit of her body, and did not give them an address, name, etc. You get the point? Without a name and an address what are they going to record? When you get home simply write the joyous event in your Bible and that is it. Same with the name change for your wife. The Bible is the highest form of identification. (this is why man will ask you to place you hand on the Bible and swear to speak the truth and then the first thing they tell you to do is to state your name.) I always have a Bible close at hand.

quote:
I am also very interested how those of you manage to buy or sell anything with out a DL. And how do manage to stay out of jail when the police pull you over.


I buy things just like most people. I go to the market to get what I need. I use cash. NO CHECKS! NO CREDIT CARDS! Selling is a different matter. I havenít sold anything that I know of since I started down this path, but I would consider that you sell what ever it is for a just price or better yet, if it is to a brother, then let them give you what they believe is just. After all, freely we receive so freely we should give.

As far as staying out of jail. Prayer. Only the Christ can keep you from going to jail if you are stopped. I have prayed this prayer many times when the "MAN" is behind me on the roads: "Heavenly Father, I pray thee, in the name of our Lord and Saviour, Christ Jesus, close this manís eyes that he might not see your servant. Your Will be done. Amen". So far so good. There are no guarantees. If I were stopped then I would pray: "Heavenly Father, I pray thee, in the name of our Lord and Saviour, Christ Jesus, open this manís ears that he might hear your words of life. Your Will be done. Amen". If the manís ears are opened he will let you go, if not, then you are going to jail. Your mode of movement will be impounded. Period. A brother that I know has been stopped twice in the last six years, both times they let him go. I havenít been stopped yet in all these years, but it is just a matter of time. We will all face various tribulations when we walk with the Christ.

quote:
But, more to the point is how can I get her name changed on her DL without a ML.


I would try using the Family Bible.

May our Lord and Saviour Jesus, the Christ, guide your steps and show you the path that you are to follow.


Edited by - DanielJacob on 09 Sep 2002 21:19:33
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sambo1011
Occasional Poster

USA
10 Posts

Posted - 13 Sep 2002 :  20:50:18  Show Profile  Visit sambo1011's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Our prayers go with you brother.


quote:
He walked out of the hospital with his wife and the fruit of her body, and did not give them an address, name, etc. You get the point? Without a name and an address what are they going to record?


I have heard of this tatic. and I am sure that is what we will do also, but I have also heard stories of the hospital taking the child away until they get what they want and it usually involves police forcing the issue. Question, how did they even get addmitted to the hosipital without revealing the parents names and "address"? What kind of hospital was it?

Also how does one travel out of the country since you can't get a passport. Or even get on a plane without a DL. I think it may have been possible to get on a plane before last Sept. but now I don't think so.

quote:
I would try using the Family Bible.


We tried the Bible, but DMV clerks aren't interested. They stonewall us "wackos" as they say.

quote:

May our Lord and Saviour Jesus, the Christ, guide your steps and show you the path that you are to follow.


It has been a several years journey now. And we are looking for the path. I feel our hand is about to be forced. And I don't want to be foolish, but I am looking for wise counsel. I often feel as I'm sure most on this board does as well. that "there aren't 7000 left that haven't bowed the knee to Baal."

I am suprised that I havn't found anyone who has also has this problem of changing a women's name on a DL.



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Owenbrittont
Advanced Member

USA
86 Posts

Posted - 14 Oct 2002 :  20:10:51  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Are there any Christian or Bible based communities who believe in separation that are currently open and active ???

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Caleb
Advanced Member

Philippines
209 Posts

Posted - 14 Oct 2002 :  23:51:59  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Here is our experience with the Birth Certificate.

Just over a year ago we gave birth to our third child in the same hospital where we had delivered our first two. We gave only our names (no SSN) upon check-in. It turns out that they still had all our details, including SSN on record from our previous visits (when we enjoyed the blissful ignorance of Caesar's bondage).

When it came time to check out, we refused to fill out the lengthy Birth Certificate form. We instead requested a 'Certified Copy of Live Birth' from the hospital. The lady in the records office knew exactly what I was referring to and said that this is what her daughter had. However, we were informed that the hospital no longer issued these and that all we could get was a State Birth Certificate.

We were allowed to check out of the hospital without incident. However, I was told that all our information would be sent to the State so they could produce a Birth Certificate. When I refused them permission to do this, they stated that they had to "by law". The hospital's attorney was beligerent and treated me like a kook despite the laws I quoted to her. As it turned out, the only information they lacked was our child's name, and as of then they still do not generate an SSN for the child unless you request them to.

I reviewed the State Law and saw that it provides for the generation of a Birth Certificate at all costs. If the parents don't cooperate, they will then get all information they can from an "informant". Needless to say, the hospital administration are very willing informants.

The lesson we learned is:
1) Don't give birth in a hospital AND make sure your midwife is not intimidated by the thought of "breaking the law" by not "informing" on you.
2) If you must give birth in a hospital, do not give them a shred of personal information, for it will all be used against you. They will probably call you something like "John and Jane Doe" and still generate a birth certificate based on that, but at least they have nothing tied to you.

Hospitals treat people every day without knowing their identity, so this should not prevent them giving you proper care. However, they might give you lots of grief including threatening to take your child from you. We had no trouble here, but in our case they had no idea of our plans until the day of departure when we already had our child with us. Nobody raised alarms when they found out we were not going to fill out the form. Get to know the staff in the recovery ward and it is unlikely they will cause trouble for you.

One of the 7000,

-Caleb

"Of the increase of His government and peace there shall be no end"
Isaiah 9:7
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Owenbrittont
Advanced Member

USA
86 Posts

Posted - 10 May 2003 :  18:27:04  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Looking to form Christian Community in Pennsylvania or join present community in tri state area...

Any communities anyone interested ????
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