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doer
Advanced Member
uSA
198 Posts |
 Posted - 24 Apr 2003 : 17:46:45
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Lewis,
Recording the eviction is not the same as recording the Land. Allodial Land is NEVER recorded ANYWHERE, else it comes under Caesar's control. The eviction is merely a public notice to proclaim ownership, similar to a Common Law Copyright proclaiming ownership of one's name.
I think that recording the eviction can be done under Common Law, similar to Randy Lee's Abatement Process, but it is just as easy to do it under statute. The point being, that one does not need to give a complete description of the Land, as in a survey. Certainly NO ADDRESS must be given, as that would identify it as Caesar's. General Delivery must be used exclusively.
We need to nail down this process, and test it to verify validity. Then we will have a fantastic resource for Good Men to finally OWN their personal, private LAND -- with our Creator's blessing, of course, since HE is the Real Owner.
Be Well,
Doer |
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True North
Advanced Member
USA
163 Posts |
Posted - 24 Apr 2003 : 17:58:05
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Berkano, Lewis (great advice) and Doer;
Doer is correct with the statement that your starting point for such a search is in the tax assessors office first and then the register of deeds office.
Assuming the tax assessor finds and gives you a parcel ID (identification) number that is listed as "unknown owner" or listed as land that was once on the tax roles and is now in some other status (caveat...I have never tried to locate land that is in any status but commercial). That parcel ID has/is listed with a short legal description and a reference to the book and page you want out of the register of deeds office to locate the past owner of that parcel of land (the tax people also have areal/aireal maps of the parcels).
The tax assessor has all commercial property listed under the owner's name, address and by legal description of Section, Township and Range (lot, block and subdivision in the city). The books in the register of deeds office list all the owners of any particular parcel as the parcel changed hands starting from the original land grants to present day. Each book represents (usually, excepting colonial states) the township [a 36 square mile block, 6 sections latitudinally (North, South) by six sections longitudinally (East, West)] in a paticular range (longitudinal designation 6 miles wide) and by the Section number (1 through 36).
The tax assessor can give you the book and page number reference of the last known owner of a parcel as listed in the register of deeds office. This is the book and page referencing the legal description by section, township and range.
For a parcel with an unknown owner you will just be working from the legal decription (Section, Township and Range) and probably just a fractional part or parcel out of some particular section. There will be no current deed recorded for a parcel with an unknown owner but the older books will list the original land grant parcels.
The register of deeds or assessor can show you how to find a parcel. You are already limited to Bannock County (because Bannock County Courthouse only has Bannock County parcels) and an area within walking distance, so maybe familiarize yourself with the township(s) and range(s) of the areas within that distance first (by requesting the assessors or register of deeds help). You can also go to http://www.topozone.com/findplace.asp and view a topo map (topography map) of the areas you are interested in by place name and county (when you zoom in it will list the section number but you must know what Township and Range you are looking at).
Some cases end up in probate court and ownership records are there instead. Parcels that have been commercial and are now not on the tax role may be extremely difficult to find. Any parcel that was never on a tax role won't show up in a search like this anyway. I personally have doubts that the tax assessor will have a clue as to what you are looking for or trying to do but I've never tried it and if you don't ask you'll not receive. Just remember Matthew 10:16, "Behold, I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves: be ye therefore wise as serpents, and harmless as doves".
Let us know your results please and get some radishes or something in the ground soon (even in the vacant lot next door :)
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Lewish
Advanced Member
uSA
496 Posts |
Posted - 24 Apr 2003 : 18:25:05
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Hi TrueNorth,
Well said. When I was doing the research in West Virginia, they had it set up a little different. They had a plat map of the county as the starting point. First was a map of the entire county and on it were lines represent areas on sub-maps. Each area had a map number. So, you find the general area you are interested in, get the sub-map number and go pull out that map. These were maps about 3.5 x 6 feet. On the sub-map were all of the ORIGINAL tracts of land. That all tracts of land when they started keeping records. Each original tract had a number. That was yet another map to look at. On that map were all the present day parcels of recorded land. Each parcel had a number on it. Using the number on the parcel you were interested in, you then went over to a box that had 3x5 index cards in it. On the index card was a listing of all of the deed books in which that parcel was recorded, and the date of recording. Thus, you had a snapshot history of the parcel. Then you could go to the deed book and look at the deed and at the survey record. After a while I got pretty good at reading the records. They used some interesting squiggles to represent very specific things. I assume at one time, every surveyor knew exactly what each of those was, but I never found any reference listing them.
It was actually quite fun and interesting. Imagine sitting there with a 250 year old survey. I mean the original, not a copy. You can't touch things like that in a museum, but there they were in the county records building. It was also interesting to notice how the paper had held up all these years, and how some inks faded more than others. If you have any interest in history, this is a very rich experience.
Lewis |
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doer
Advanced Member
uSA
198 Posts |
Posted - 24 Apr 2003 : 20:05:34
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These are all excellent instructions.
But how would a once-commercial property now fall off the tax rolls? This is not at all like Caesar's way. It would be sold at auction for past taxes, rather than written off.
Allodial Land may not have any history at all, depending on where it is located. Land west of the Mississippi is probably all recorded as grants or patents from the government after it was taken over. But the Original Colonies (and Texas) may still have true Allodial Land with no record whatsoever, since Allodial Land can be handed down from generation to generation without government's knowledge. This is a situation that begs for research.
Be Well,
Doer |
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berkano
Advanced Member
uSA
129 Posts |
Posted - 24 Apr 2003 : 21:24:18
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Hey all brothers,
Thanks for the advice and input on this topic. You are all blessed because of your willingness to help others reason and arrive at the truth. I am grateful for your discussions and arguments; I've learned much, but never enough, no, never enough!
I have a clearer idea of what to look and ask for on the land maps. Also, I found several mountain ranges in Idaho and Wyoming that show no evidence of any improved roads whatsoever traversing them in very large tracts, and some areas of these are not marked off as national forest or some type of reserve; therefore, to cultivate the land would be an activity enjoyed without molestation, and probably without even verbal protest from the LEO's.
I know of other places in other states that I could go right now, but I do not want to because most of the people I know and love are located near here. It would be lonely to go far away and be a hermit; I want to do the exact opposite and provide an example of how things can be done for the support of a small assembly of people who are die-hard about being free to serve God.
Now I gotta use the shoe-leather express to check out some places near here first.
Send out your prayers please! I need some power greater than my own to get these things done, and in an approbable manner to God.
Blessings,
- Berkano |
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berkano
Advanced Member
uSA
129 Posts |
Posted - 24 Apr 2003 : 21:29:41
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quote:
Originally posted by doer
Lewis,
Since "adverse possession" has become a statutory process, why would you want to return the Land from Allodium to Caesar’s realm? My understanding is that, after you have established yourself upon the Land, then you can record an eviction on a fictitious "John Doe" to show than you are the rightful owner (since no one will challenge the action), So Caesar will also thereby recognizes your ownership, since he is too stupid to challenge it, either -- and has no standing in Law to do so anyway. The Maxim here is that an Affidavit unchallenged, resides in Truth.
THEN you are free to do whatever you want with the Land -- NO assessments, NO taxes, NO building codes, and NO Caesar sticking his fat nose in your private business! Only get it surveyed using meats and bounds, instead of using “parcels,” “plots” or “subdivisions” -- in order to keep it Lawful.
Be Well,
Doer
Doer,
How would one record this "eviction" affidavit? Who would it be served upon? What facts and evidence would have to be noticed in it? How would a default be served, and by whom, and upon whom? Would it be lawful to note the lattitude and longitude of the boundaries, or perhaps of just a corner, and go by metes, bounds, and feet from there?
Much information for consideration, eh?
- Berkano |
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berkano
Advanced Member
uSA
129 Posts |
Posted - 24 Apr 2003 : 21:39:33
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quote:
Originally posted by doer
Berkano,
You are to be commended for endeavoring upon such a quest! You will learn many things about Caesar's ways in you search, and it is important for you to share those findings with others seeking the Truth.
Since I am not converstant in the area of your interest, not much help can be given at this time. Lewis has another approach to freeing land from Caesar's control, and perhaps he would be kind enough to detail that process when it is confirmed.
You may be able to get a print-out from the assessor's office, of land designated "owner unknown" -- or whatever term they use for Allodial lands. I once had a list of all assessed county property made for myself in Oregon, and it cost about $50. They may charge you for such a print-out or computer disk, but it is well worth it, as you would have a complete list to investigate. Perhaps they can even do a search for you, for those particular designations which interest you, then print out that list.
This is all that can be given to you at this time. Good hunting!
Be Well,
Doer
Doer,
Thank you for pronouncing your blessing upon me. Please also take a moment sometime to pray for me, because although I feel what I am doing is for the right reasons, I still feel that I have no way to know if anything is true until I have tested it. A man would have to live a *very* long time to test the truth of even a few things conclusively. So I need God to guide me, and your faith and prayers are better than mine alone.
I most definitely want to share the things I have learned in my quest of approximately thirty years. That is the one greatest, most important reason I am motivated to stand upon the land. I want to build a few houses, plant some gardens, and invite others to come and take refuge while we all work together to get through the matrix of lies to a harvest of truth and simplicity. Then I want to sit back as the garden grows and write, write, write. I have literally dozens of books floating around in my mind that want to find paper and foreign eyes; the frustration of doing other "necessary" things instead is almost unbearable, because I know I have a story to share that can help others in their journeys.
I do not want to be free to pursue anything of the flesh; I want my freedom to do the will of Him that made me, for His will is freedom. I want to build a refuge and homeland for others who feel, live, and breathe this sentiment of freedom.
Blessings,
- Berkano |
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doer
Advanced Member
uSA
198 Posts |
Posted - 26 Apr 2003 : 03:27:56
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Berkano,
In proving your claim to "ownership" of any Land (always keeping in mind the True Owner of the Universe), the process of eviction is used. I am not sure if you, personally, can serve "John Doe," but a friend can be used for the service. Neither are you required to serve "John Doe" in the flesh, for "he" may not always be available. Since you cannot be expected to do anything unreasonable, such as sitting around for days waiting for "John Doe" to appear, it is lawful to post the eviction notice on "his" place of residence, or in any conspicuous place, such as nailing to a tree next to a footpath.
Neither am I sure about the exact Common Law process for filing the eviction. We are walking on dangerous ground here, because of the mixing of Common Law process with statute -- which mixing will nullify most Common Law protection, unless done properly. But having done a few statutory evictions many years ago, the best way is to go to the county court house and ask for the papers to fill out. The clerks there can give basic explanations, but are not allowed to give legal advice. Of course “John Doe” will not appear at the hearing to counter your claim, so you win by default. It may also be possible to use notary public services for accomplishing some of this process, though I am not familiar with the procedures nor the supporting Law.
Once all the paperwork has been completed, you have a “paper trail” to prove your ownership. Of course you NEVER, EVER register the Land with ANY government clerk or agency, unless you wish to be downgraded to “tenant” status and begin paying rent (property taxes). Again -- I am not certain of the Common Law process, or whether you can use statutory process for the same purpose. Call Randy Lee in S. California and explain your intent. Be clear as to what you want to do exactly, before you call. Randy or one of his people can explain the Common Law regarding almost any issue, a thousand times better than I can. He has compiled a vast library of Common Law resources, which he can send to you on CD. His link is at the bottom of this note. He also offers a “free” information packet, though personally I would give a free-will offering to cover costs. He can be tracked down at the following numbers:
http://www.angelfire.com/pr/truth/contact.html
Your goal of striving to build a few houses, then to invite like-minded people to share in the freedom, is quite laudable. If you are moved to write books, then write a HANDBOOK in easily-understood language, to guide other Souls through the maze of Caesar’s “law” to freedom. I well know the difficulty in finding the time to do these things, as most of our time seems to be required just to “keep body and Soul together.” However, we must remember that our accomplishments do not go unnoticed by our Creator. The PROCESS itself, of arriving at a certain level of understanding and freedom, is a very great accomplishment.
This is easily understood when we only look upon the BILLIONS of lost Souls in this present world -- suffering every day (nay, every hour), just to scratch a living from the earth, with no time even to THINK about anything but how to get the next meal. So we are unbelievably BLESSED, and any quest that we have time to seek, can only be a great joy and a rewarding, uplifting experience. Then it is easy to see the reason that we must share our experience with others.
Some resources you may wish to explore (live links that I have just visited) --
http://www.lectlaw.com/def/a040.htm
http://www.freedomdispatch.org/tablec_A.htm
http://www.angelfire.com/pr/truth/movement.html
http://www.angelfire.com/pr/truth/irs.html
http://www.angelfire.com/pr/truth/assembly.html
Be Well,
Doer
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DanielJacob
Advanced Member
USA
138 Posts |
Posted - 26 Apr 2003 : 10:43:10
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Brothers,
This is an area in which I have spent much time and study. I have been looking for suitable habitable land for several years. I have found several large parcels but none that would support farming. If you submit any kind of "paperwork" concerning the land you are possibly going to stir up an unnecessary controversy. If you can surmise that no one is in possession of the land then you simply make entry and take possession; and then hold it against all trespassers. Post the land with the Posting the Close from this site. If our Father truly wants you to have the land he will protect you, if not, then you will be put off.
For some reason we have this desire to issue some sort of paperwork even when it is not necessary. Maybe that is still the natural man in us. The natural man looks to pieces of paper to substantiate or justify his actions or positions. We, brothers in Christ, should look only to Him. If there is land that you have an hereditary right in [can you say Christ’s estate] you take possession of the land as long as no one else is on it. If someone challenges your right to that land then the paperwork begins. It is done in the form of a writ; a writ of entry; writ of ejectment; writ of right; writ of trespass; etc. depending upon what and how you are being damaged. It is through these types of writs that absolute right of possession is tried and determined.
Example of a writ of entry:
The King (*the Christ) to the sheriff, greeting.
If A shall make you secure, &c. then summon, &c. twelve free and lawful men of the neighbourhood of Trumpington that they be before our justices at the first assize when they shall come into those parts, ready to recognize by oath if B father [mother, brother, sister, uncle, aunt,] of the aforesaid A was seised in his demesne as of fee, of one messuage with the appurtenances in Trumpington the day hereon he died, and if he died after [the period of limitation] and if the same A be his next heir; and in the mean time let them view the said messuage, and cause their names to be put in the writ, and summon by good summoners X who now holds the aforesaid messuage, that he may be there to hear that recongnizance; and have there the summoners and this writ. (*my interpolation)
Assisa de Morte Antecessoris (Latin version of same)
Rex vicecomiti salutem.
Si A fecerit te securum de clamore suo prosequendo tunc summoneas per bonos summonitores xij liberos et legales homines de visneto de Trumpingtone quod sint coram justiciariis nostris ad primam assisam cum in partes illas vernerint, parati sacramento recognoscere si B pater, [mater, frater, soror, avunculus, amita,] predicti A fuit seisitus in dominico suo ut de feodo de uno mesuagio cum pertinentiis in Trumpingtone die quo obiit, et si obiit post [period of limitation], et si idem A ejus haeres propinquoir sit. Et interim praedictum mesuagium videant et nomina corum inbreviari facias. Et summone per bonos summonitores X qui mesuagium praedictum tenet quod tunc sit ibi auditurus illam recognitionem. Et habeas ibi summonitores et hoc breve.
We, of course, would have to prepare our own writs emanating from a Lawful assembly made up of at least three members. These writs would be in a similar manner and format as the abatements. I had been working on a writ of right some time ago but never finished it. Perhaps it is time to do so.
Peace be with you all.
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Edited by - DanielJacob on 26 Apr 2003 10:46:36 |
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DanielJacob
Advanced Member
USA
138 Posts |
Posted - 26 Apr 2003 : 11:10:21
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Brothers,
It seems that the Post that I spoke of is no longer on the site, at least I couldn't find it so below please find the same.
Posted
Notice to All Breaking the Close over this land:
Daniel Jacob, an obedient son of the Eternal our Father solely by His Grace Through our Blessed Lord and Saviour, Jesus, the Christ; to all breaking this Close of and over this land, greetings from the Eternal, our Father, and His Son Christ Jesus:
In the Blessed Name and Authority of our Lord and Saviour, Jesus, the Christ, by His Direction and Mandate, and under His Warrant in His Testament, I hereby post the following at the gates to this Close of and over this land and on the door posts of the dwelling-house therein;
And whereas, the earth is the Lord’s and the fullness thereof, and His Intent manifested in His original Act in His Testament of bringing into being His Estate, governs all derived from it; therefore when the Eternal our Father sent His Son to execute His Testament according to His Will, so His Son sent into the world those called by Him from the foundation of the world for His Dignity, Glory, Majesty and purposes:
And whereas, all Power in heaven and in earth hath been committed to Christ Jesus by the Eternal our Father, Who bestows the same upon those Whom He hath called and sent into the world in execution of, and to execute, the Righteous Judgments in His Holy Writ in His Name and under His Warrants contained therein;
And whereas, as many as believe in and on His Son, He gives the power to become the sons of the Eternal by and through adoption, and a son hath Inheritance common in all other sons through and in Christ Jesus, therefore the Close of and over this land, and all Rights in and of the Inheritance established by, through and in Christ Jesus, have been Willed by the Eternal our Father, through our Lord and Saviour, Jesus, the Christ, to Daniel Jacob and his seed in perpetuity;
And whereas, the Will of our King and Testator, in His Law and Testament instituting the Inheritance establishes and governs the Rights of those who Inherit the Close of and over this land instituted by our King in His Law and Testament, therefore those who act and do contrary to the Will of our King and Testator are not His sons, but bastards, having no Close or right in and to any Inheritance established by the Will of our Blessed King and Testator;
And whereas, the Law of the Eternal and the law of the land are all one, and both favour and preserve the common good of the land, therefore ignorance of God’s Law is no excuse, for all men know the Eternal, even His eternal Power and Godhead, and are not presumed ignorant of their eternal welfare;
And wherefore, any and all who enter here without consent evidenced by Warrant in Law from the Eternal our Father, through our Lord and Saviour, Jesus, the Christ, and His several appointed Ministerial Officers having and being of one Mind in Christ, but enter either in their own name or by the name of a stranger having no Rights of and in the Inheritance common among Good and Lawful Christians; One, break this Close; Two, breach the Peace of our King, by violating His Law establishing this Close and all Powers appertaining to the Noble and Sacred Ministerial Office of Christ; Three, destroy the Domestic Tranquillity of His son; Four, endanger His Inheritance in and of His son by adoption; and, Five, are, in His Law governing this Close, trespassers, thieves, and robbers, having not entered through the Door;
And therefore, an action of trespass, quare clausam fregit will lie against all such who break this Close through or under such pretenses or color of Law.
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Lewish
Advanced Member
uSA
496 Posts |
Posted - 26 Apr 2003 : 12:08:12
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Hi Berkano,
If those large tracts of land in Idaho or Wyoming are National Forest, you can bet that they are BLM. All large tracts of land in the West are owned by the Government. Get you a DeLorme "Atlas & Gazetteer" of the state you are interested in. This will give you topo information, and will indicate who controls those large areas. I have these for about a dozen states. Very useful. They show roads that don't show on most other maps. They cost less than $20 each and can be ordered directly if you can't find them locally.
Lewis |
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doer
Advanced Member
uSA
198 Posts |
Posted - 26 Apr 2003 : 19:50:02
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Daniel Jacob,
This is all excellent material.
There is only one problem. So let us establish ourselves upon some Land. Let us build houses and barns and other out buildings. Let us plant gardens and fields. Let us work the Land and make it bountiful.
Then let us be summoned before the Magistrate for trespass. What then?
If we do not establish our claim to the Land before we put our life's labor and sweat into it, then all is for naught. We are fools to think that we can just squat on some Land and then it comes under our control. We are fools to think that our Creator will protect us from our folly.
What we need to establish, is the correct process for validating our claim. Only if no one else claims the Land, can we claim it in the name of our Creator. And even if someone else does claim it, their claim may be defective. So we still may have a chance to rightful claim. But we definitely need effective process to validate our claim, in any case.
Be Well,
Doer |
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Lewish
Advanced Member
uSA
496 Posts |
Posted - 26 Apr 2003 : 22:06:13
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Well put Doer,
And I will add, if you get to know the people in the area where you want to buy land, they will often tell you of some really good bargins. For example, I missed a 40 acre piece of land for $10,000. And it was simply because I hadn't had the time to stay on top of the local scene. A timber company bought it. They cut less than half of the timber off of it to pay it off. Fortunately, it was the only good timber company around, and they did strip and ruin the land. I suspect that you could still buy it for what they paid for it last September. The price for timber has gone down the drain, and the timber companies are going belly-up. (I know of three already that are having their logging equipment repo-ed). I plan to offer them $5000 for it in a few months from now.
So, just a few more things to consider. As we slide further into recession, despite and the rosy reports in the news media about economic recovery, you are going to see more and more opportunities. Find the area you want to live in. Get to know as many people as possible in that area. Have them put the word out about what you are looking for and what you are willing to pay. Then pray about it. The good Lord above will lead you to what is right for you.
Peace,
Lewis |
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Robert-James
Advanced Member
uSA
353 Posts |
Posted - 26 Apr 2003 : 22:18:05
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| I hope you all know that the Pope and his own have laid claim to the earth. The Queen's men have fought against this for sometime, yet are bound to a Treaty established in 1213 by {King} John, who gave up sovereign rights to England Ireland and France to save his pitiful soul. So, in the end of the matter, One will be up against the Pope and to his claim of ownership. Know thy enemy! The Pope is a LEGAL FICTION, in the Law of Nations. As is the QUEEN ElIZABETH. The questions is; are you a legal fiction also, a pretender? Or, are you truely another Son of the Living Creator? Then the final word...prove it. Yahushua {aka Jesus} is looking for a place to lay His head. |
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Lewish
Advanced Member
uSA
496 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2003 : 02:29:31
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The earth is the Lord's and the fullness thereof.
I don't really care who else has laid claim to it. |
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Robert-James
Advanced Member
uSA
353 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2003 : 09:25:43
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| Forewarned is fore-armed, Lewish. The minions of the vicar of christ are real. www.tuppersaussy.com The un-civil war was started and organized by Jesuits, in order to capture the Protestants. A goddess was placed atop the Capital building in 1863. The property tax collectors are only first line defense of the vicar's claim. Want a refresher on how PRETENDERS are dealt with? Remember Waco. Does your Lord have a name? For there are many "Lords". Moses did not come to Pharoah and say, "The Lord sent me". |
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DanielJacob
Advanced Member
USA
138 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2003 : 11:00:24
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Brother George,
How do you think they did it in the beginning? They didn't make up paperwork to establish their claim. Possession is a valid title. If you have possession of the land and they want to put you off, then, you start the actions at common law. There has to be a damage before you can proceed. You could post a notice that you were going to claim the land if you liked but my point was that anyone who knew just a little about property law would run down to the registrar's office and file a Quick Claim on that land. You would then be drawn into their courts to fight with their law. You would be in a defensive position instead of an offensive position. If you have possession the burden is on them not on you.
Peace brother. |
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Lewish
Advanced Member
uSA
496 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2003 : 12:06:13
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Robert-James,
There is only one Lord, all others are lords. The same as there is only one G-d and all others are gods.
You keep posting messages with an attitude of arrogance and as though all others are in ignorance. I find this quite unacceptable and quite unlike someone who is truly following the commands of G-d and Jesus.
I forgive you this,
Lewis |
Edited by - Lewish on 27 Apr 2003 12:07:16 |
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Robert-James
Advanced Member
uSA
353 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2003 : 17:21:33
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Greetings Lewish. You still didn't answer what the name of your Lord is. I have been called alot worse than arrogant and am not offended. The sin you forgive may be in your own heart. Proverbs 30:4 is all I was asking. And I surmise you'd
call the spirit of YaHuWeH arrogant also? Time to repent of Rome's dogma Lewish. Also, I do not follow the commands of G-D and Jesus. Just what is G-D? I've seen this among the Jewish messanic folks. |
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Lewish
Advanced Member
uSA
496 Posts |
Posted - 27 Apr 2003 : 18:53:46
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Greetings Robert-James. Just what is YaHuWeh? Is this the Romanized version of a Hebrew word? Or is this some made up word to represent something you can't otherwise explain? You quote Proverbs, but then you turn around and say you don't follow the commands of the Almighty One who Proverbs is all about. Major contradiction here. I write the G-d out of reverance for the one it represents. My Bible teaches me not to use HIS name in casual conversation. If you subscribe to some doctrine other than Christianity, then I suggest you are in the wrong forum.
Peace be unto you,
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