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T O P I C    R E V I E W
Cowboy Posted - 07 Jun 2002 : 14:19:06
Anyone done this ?
Or have any other experiences with traffic related issues.

There are many court cases stating that licenses are only requierd for commercial uses.

JN 17:17
20   L A T E S T    R E P L I E S    (Newest First)
greatfull Posted - 06 May 2014 : 15:01:43
quote:
Originally posted by Linc

quote:
Originally posted by Lewish

Hello Brothers,

We discovered this week, that if you have proper standing as a man on the land, as a citizen thereon, that in the state of Michigan, at least, and I suspect it is true in other states, we are checking, that there is a form that can be executed to get an exemption from having to have a Driver License. After completing the form, and presenting it at the DoL, they will issue you a Driver License Exemption card that can be presented to any revenue enhancement officer that chooses to stop you.



Nifty, keep us updated. Can you give your reply to my post on the "Interesting experience at the bank" thread?





greatfull Posted - 10 Aug 2013 : 23:45:00
get fact abt the foney system
get the precepts,
it is the part of being deceived into the instruments, bc ssn etc and how to honorably peacefully and obediently to the true king remove from it that is question? do you care to share your process, steps ?

quote:
Originally posted by ghostwalter

I haven't logged in for quite some time, looking and trying to learn from failed attempts of facilitating some forum of freedom. In some of the discussions I see that the retoric must seem to generate some thing to the nature of biblical text. In others over the distance of time and space I see the generation of earnest effort of combat, which there should be. Yet from the peanut gallery I hear words from bible text in negative reference.

I see only one fact; a free people try hard to stay free. The fact remains you are all trying to free your self from a system of things, rather than establishing yourselves into a new sytem under the law that provides for it. The precepts are there, don't be blinded by what is before you, circumvent their statutes that mean nothing,

greatfull Posted - 10 Aug 2013 : 23:07:15
humm,thank you for responding
for some reason it just seems there should ought to be a better way- female here and not excited at all about the
4 wall thing place-

concerned however especially since the real id act and all
and not able to get brand new from manufacturer car
have to support self blah blah

already have a ssn do not use it
now
have not ever registered- voted apparantly that is good

so much to absorb

take care
studying researching seeking
trusting and obeying


quote:
Originally posted by Bondservant

I can only tell you that I freely travel in my non-commercial ID non-named truck (I removed the Ford logos) and I have been arrested for "No DL" along with "no registration" 5 times in the past 12 years. In each case, I sent the DA a notice that I refused their fine and penalty in unlawful FRN's and that I am not a legal resident (search what is on this site from many years ago regarding the legal term 'RESIDENT' at http://www.ecclesia.org/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=29 and http://ecclesia.org/forum/uploads/bondservant/weekly17P.pdf) of their franchise STATE OF FLORIDA. I continually notified them every time that I was (back then) a Florida State Citizen, not a US (DC) citizen or a STATE OF (fill in your STATE) citizen.

The truth is, I am a lawful native American having been born on the land and have lawfully and legally voided (in public county record, 1994) all known and unknown contracts with any Federal US CITIZENSHIP (which is not lawfully a USA citizenship) and the franchise STATE OF FLORIDA CITIZENSHIP.

Yes, of course they always ignore me and they ignore certified Clerk copies of my lawfully AND legally rescinded contract notice, but then when I demand a trial, the judge on the trial day is always a "visiting judge," the courtroom is always changed to a different room number without notice on the court docket or posted courthouse daily postings (I have an assistant clerk who keeps me informed of that) and the "court" is always beyond shocked when I show up and demand an immediate dismissal for fraud upon the court.

Look.... it's a scam game and you need to simply realize that if you stand up and demand true jurisdiction, you will either get a non-response from a "judge" who quickly leaves the "court", or you will be thrown into their Stalag for "contempt" because you pissed them off with the truth.

I've spent many 71 hour periods in their local jail, but I have always refused to sign anything they present to me and I have always refused to speak when they demand I answer. Before the 72 hours is up, I'm quickly released.

I do not participate with the Social Security System (since it is legally voluntarily), so they don't get a SSAN to keep me there without getting Fed funds after 72 hours.

That's how it works. Learn by trial and error like I have. Go to their jail and do what I have. You'll find out that the magician's smoke and mirrors are just that. Sign nothing and do not agree to be photographed on the record (although they will do it anyway). Do not agree to an iris scan or fingerpirnt (they will do it anyway). The point is, if you do NOT agree, it's on record and "they" know it because Open Records Acts and FOIA will reveal that fact.

The FED and STATE Wizard of OZ is nothing but a fraud.

Caleb Posted - 27 Jul 2013 : 05:29:18
I have battled this issue as well, Down Under in Little 'Ol New Zealand, where the laws come straight from the UK and we have a single sets of statutes covering the country. No Federal - State - Local division of laws to leave you guessing what actually applies to your circumstances.

It is maxim of law that to understand a matter you must go back to the point of origin. What I have done, rather than angrily denounce the system as unlawful and their statutes as meaningless, is to logically trace everything back to its point of origin.

We know that a "driver" is one who is travelling commercially. So the first question is, what if anything, are we doing that is commercial in nature? In New Zealand it is painfully clear once you look at the Vehicle Registration. EVERY Vehicle is registered under an "Industrial Class". So it is the fact of registration that turns the non-commecial "automobile" (no statutes whatsoever regulating automobiles) into a commercial "vehicle" for which you must be licensed if you want to use the thing.

But it goes a layer deeper. The definition of "vehicle" shows that they are not really talking about a hunk of metal with 4 wheels. The registration of the automobile causes them to take out an insurance bond, or something along those lines. Thus, the actual "vehicle" is a financial instrument that they are regulating, and the "automobile" is the surety!

So they must track the automobile, and regulate the "drivers" in order to look after their investment. Thus the license plate will be linked to the VIN (vehicle identification number) and the VIN actually identifies the financial instrument. This is so important that the VIN gets etched into the engine block and the rear window, AND they link it to the car chassis number, just in case you scratch off both VIN numbers, as I did.

I had the NZ Police leaving me alone until one day when they saw my automobile parked in the local mall parking lot. They broke into the car, opened the hood, and found the chassis number. The next time they saw me behind the wheel, they arrested me.

It did not matter that my automobile had been deregistered. The insurance bond was still on their system, and they still claimed the right to regulate it. But they had to be able to identify it before they would touch me!

And don't think that the insurance bond is meaningless, or an evil trick. They actually ARE running an insurance scheme to deal with all of the accidents that happen with automobiles. How do you think they pay for the Police, Ambulance, Fire engines, and other services that show up to clean up the mess? Sure, they won't replace your damaged automobile, but their insurance program does pay for necessary services none-the-less.

So the bottom line is, unless you can get your hands on an automobile that has NEVER been registered in ANY State system, you are going to be beaten up on the highways and byways if you are caught behind the wheel of a registered (insured) automobile without the proper license.

Honi soit qui mal y pense
ghostwalter Posted - 23 Jul 2013 : 23:18:38
I haven't logged in for quite some time, looking and trying to learn from failed attempts of facilitating some forum of freedom. In some of the discussions I see that the retoric must seem to generate some thing to the nature of biblical text. In others over the distance of time and space I see the generation of earnest effort of combat, which there should be. Yet from the peanut gallery I hear words from bible text in negative reference.

I see only one fact; a free people try hard to stay free. The fact remains you are all trying to free your self from a system of things, rather than establishing yourselves into a new sytem under the law that provides for it. The precepts are there, don't be blinded by what is before you, circumvent their statutes that mean nothing,
Bondservant Posted - 23 Jul 2013 : 21:12:18
I can only tell you that I freely travel in my non-commercial ID non-named truck (I removed the Ford logos) and I have been arrested for "No DL" along with "no registration" 5 times in the past 12 years. In each case, I sent the DA a notice that I refused their fine and penalty in unlawful FRN's and that I am not a legal resident (search what is on this site from many years ago regarding the legal term 'RESIDENT' at http://www.ecclesia.org/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=29 and http://ecclesia.org/forum/uploads/bondservant/weekly17P.pdf) of their franchise STATE OF FLORIDA. I continually notified them every time that I was (back then) a Florida State Citizen, not a US (DC) citizen or a STATE OF (fill in your STATE) citizen.

The truth is, I am a lawful native American having been born on the land and have lawfully and legally voided (in public county record, 1994) all known and unknown contracts with any Federal US CITIZENSHIP (which is not lawfully a USA citizenship) and the franchise STATE OF FLORIDA CITIZENSHIP.

Yes, of course they always ignore me and they ignore certified Clerk copies of my lawfully AND legally rescinded contract notice, but then when I demand a trial, the judge on the trial day is always a "visiting judge," the courtroom is always changed to a different room number without notice on the court docket or posted courthouse daily postings (I have an assistant clerk who keeps me informed of that) and the "court" is always beyond shocked when I show up and demand an immediate dismissal for fraud upon the court.

Look.... it's a scam game and you need to simply realize that if you stand up and demand true jurisdiction, you will either get a non-response from a "judge" who quickly leaves the "court", or you will be thrown into their Stalag for "contempt" because you pissed them off with the truth.

I've spent many 71 hour periods in their local jail, but I have always refused to sign anything they present to me and I have always refused to speak when they demand I answer. Before the 72 hours is up, I'm quickly released.

I do not participate with the Social Security System (since it is legally voluntarily), so they don't get a SSAN to keep me there without getting Fed funds after 72 hours.

That's how it works. Learn by trial and error like I have. Go to their jail and do what I have. You'll find out that the magician's smoke and mirrors are just that. Sign nothing and do not agree to be photographed on the record (although they will do it anyway). Do not agree to an iris scan or fingerpirnt (they will do it anyway). The point is, if you do NOT agree, it's on record and "they" know it because Open Records Acts and FOIA will reveal that fact.

The FED and STATE Wizard of OZ is nothing but a fraud.
greatfull Posted - 21 Jul 2013 : 23:06:08

actually i was attempting to post a inquiry along lines of what
you are inquiring of me, and being kinda new around here
ended up just posting his post....lol

wondering if anyone here has any recent proven processes that are working regarding the travel-movement issue and not using or renewing dr lic and the other instruments- reading richard anthonys info on c.l.a. it said to trash them- however
seems like that would create other issues...

so many different opinions etc and want to be in honor and Truth, obedient....
apologize for the mess up on post , but nice to know there are people here..

t quote]Originally posted by Jay Scott

Nice reminder! I imagine Lewis is well.

greatfull, do you have recent experience to share with "not amenable to process" or "driver licenses?"

Jay Scott.
[/quote]
Jay Scott Posted - 21 Jul 2013 : 17:02:48
Nice reminder! I imagine Lewis is well.

greatfull, do you have recent experience to share with "not amenable to process" or "driver licenses?"

Jay Scott.
greatfull Posted - 21 Jul 2013 : 16:03:19
quote:
Originally posted by Lewish

Hello Brother oneisraelite,

I just wanted to see if anyone was really paying attention.

Yes, I advised him to obey the Court order, as he has not yet done the 4 steps to freedom. To have refused would have landed him back in jail on a Contempt of Court charge.

I recommended to the young man, that when he signed the license, directly above his signature that he print very clearly and carefully the words "Not Amenable to Process". Do not confuse the word amenable with the word amendable. Look in up in Black's 4th.

I believe you will know the answer to your second question as soon as you read the definition in Black's.

Everyone here is a student. That is why we are here. I learn from others, you learn from me. I will gladly share any knowledge that I have. I will also always try to give you the source of that knowledge.

The phrase "Not Amenable to Process" came about because people were trying to use "Without Prejudice UCC 1-207" and were achieving what had been promised. Well, no wonder. The UCC is private copyrighted code belonging to Unidroit in Italy, and they haven't paid their copyright fees. Thus, they have no claim for its use. Some have tried using just the "Without Prejudice". Well, all that says to the system is "I have reserved all my rights, now go ahead and prosecute me in your Court."

I did not originate the phrase, but simply applied it to a proper use. It is important to always restrict your signature any time and any place you give it.


Peace to you,

Lewis

Roger Lee Posted - 08 May 2008 : 08:12:05
Yes Jay. I have that second witness.

Roger
Jay Scott Posted - 07 May 2008 : 18:00:11
Roger,

Did you have a Notary Public witness and certify their non-response? I'm wondering if the Certificate of Non-Response would be advantageous in any way.

(See this thread: "Notary Public and their powers" http://ecclesia.org/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=463 )

Jay Scott.


quote:
Originally posted by Roger Lee


Yes Scott, I made a request for 12 proofs of claim. Never heard from the MV Commissioner. So I returned the DL directly to him explaining that I was not a "driver' as defined in the statues: "Driver" means any person who drives, operates or is in physical control of a commercial motor vehicle, or who is required to hold a commercial driver's license."



Roger

Roger Lee Posted - 07 May 2008 : 12:02:39
quote:
Upon returning the DL to the DMV, did you complete an administrative process to secure agreement with the government leaders near you that the DL is not required for you to travel on common-ways in modern conveyance?


Yes Scott, I made a request for 12 proofs of claim. Never heard from the MV Commissioner. So I returned the DL directly to him explaining that I was not a "driver' as defined in the statues: "Driver" means any person who drives, operates or is in physical control of a commercial motor vehicle, or who is required to hold a commercial driver's license."



Roger
Jay Scott Posted - 06 May 2008 : 07:25:05
Roger,

Thanks for sharing your experience. That's encouraging to me. I'm working on some other things now but hope to get there. Thinking ahead...

Upon returning the DL to the DMV, did you complete an administrative process to secure agreement with the government leaders near you that the DL is not required for you to travel on common-ways in modern conveyance?

Walking by faith proves to be a struggle for me (I think my pride gets in the way). But I'm convinced it IS the path to obedience and, therefore, peace. Recently at a funeral while a projector flashed photos of the dearly departed and family on a big screen, scripture passage would be interjected periodically. I recall one passage suggesting that the author looks through a glass darkly in his current state but will at some point see clearly. And that in the meantime, I assume to overcome the darkness of the glass, he has faith, hope, and charity to rely upon. Reading that was an encouragement to me to continue the struggle with faith which I think means listening for my Maker to compel me to act and my being willing to do so even though I may not want to, or understand how, why, or what the consequences of the act will be.

Be blessed.

Jay Scott.



quote:
Originally posted by Roger Lee

As with anything in life, you begin with prayer. Then you study the issue with great diligence. Then you prepare yourself for the attacks. That last bit is most difficult because you never know what tactics the enemy will pull.

In November of last year I was stopped in smalltown Connecticut and ticketed for no registration and no insurance. My car was recorded on a UCC-3, but I didn't have a certified copy. As bizarre as this may sound, the Sgt. (one of two backups who were called in because I dared to ask a question of the officer who stopped me) offered me the option of having my car towed to the impound lot or to my final destination some 20 miles away. We settled on having my car towed to the town line and it was given back to me.

In court, I presented my now certified paperwork to the court clerk and she asked me to wait in the lobby rather than enter the courtroom. An hour and a half later she comes out, hands me my paperwork and says I'm free to go.

I now live in Massachusetts. Life is different here. (Oh, between moves, I sent my driver license back to the Connecticut MVD via a disinterested third party.) Got pulled over in smalltown Mass. Ticketed for no registration, no license (it's still on file on Connecticut which was a real surprise), no insurance. Car impounded. It took them a month to send me an invitation to court. In the interim I sent CAFVs to the cop and the towing company. I now have the cops tacit agreement through dishonor that he had no authority and the towing guy's tacit agreement that he's in possession of stolen property.

My court date is two months from now.

Bottom line all this is very taxing. I'm learning there's more than one way to skin a cat, but not really sure if any of them really work 100% of the time. I'm walking in faith. But for now, the peace that surpasses all understanding escapes me.

Do understand that there have been dozens of small victories since I put private plates on my car 10 months ago. I've been followed by cops in many jurisdictions and none have stopped me. I post a notice on the back of may car that I do not operate in commerce and surprisingly, most get the message and leave me alone.

Roger

Roger Lee Posted - 05 May 2008 : 11:12:35
As with anything in life, you begin with prayer. Then you study the issue with great diligence. Then you prepare yourself for the attacks. That last bit is most difficult because you never know what tactics the enemy will pull.

In November of last year I was stopped in smalltown Connecticut and ticketed for no registration and no insurance. My car was recorded on a UCC-3, but I didn't have a certified copy. As bizarre as this may sound, the Sgt. (one of two backups who were called in because I dared to ask a question of the officer who stopped me) offered me the option of having my car towed to the impound lot or to my final destination some 20 miles away. We settled on having my car towed to the town line and it was given back to me.

In court, I presented my now certified paperwork to the court clerk and she asked me to wait in the lobby rather than enter the courtroom. An hour and a half later she comes out, hands me my paperwork and says I'm free to go.

I now live in Massachusetts. Life is different here. (Oh, between moves, I sent my driver license back to the Connecticut MVD via a disinterested third party.) Got pulled over in smalltown Mass. Ticketed for no registration, no license (it's still on file on Connecticut which was a real surprise), no insurance. Car impounded. It took them a month to send me an invitation to court. In the interim I sent CAFVs to the cop and the towing company. I now have the cops tacit agreement through dishonor that he had no authority and the towing guy's tacit agreement that he's in possession of stolen property.

My court date is two months from now.

Bottom line all this is very taxing. I'm learning there's more than one way to skin a cat, but not really sure if any of them really work 100% of the time. I'm walking in faith. But for now, the peace that surpasses all understanding escapes me.

Do understand that there have been dozens of small victories since I put private plates on my car 10 months ago. I've been followed by cops in many jurisdictions and none have stopped me. I post a notice on the back of may car that I do not operate in commerce and surprisingly, most get the message and leave me alone.

Roger
Lewish Posted - 08 Oct 2007 : 17:49:08
Brothers,

An interesting way to handle a side of the road encounter is to start out by being very friendly and cordial to the officer. Then inform him that you are granting the Trust that he is requesting, but that you as Grantor, and by the authority of Grantor, are appointing him Trustee of that Trust and making him responsible for everything related to the Trust. Then suggest politely, that if he doesn't understand he new responsibilities, that perhaps it would be prudent for him to contact legal assistance of his law enforcement agency.

What we have seen so far is that the officer after talking to "legal assistance" no longer is interested in doing business with the Grantor of the Trust.

Remember, he is trying to get you into a contract. All contracts are Trusts and all Trusts are contracts.


Lewis
A Man on the Land on Washington as a Citizen thereon.
Bondservant Posted - 01 Oct 2007 : 08:52:14
quote:
Originally posted by Greg

Greetings Marty, Thomas7, and others.
The answer to your query Marty is here within this site. Not trying to be elusive, but there is a great deal of reading one can and should do in the "resources" area, "Devoted to truth" link.
I believe I've read nearly everything there and it was a great help to me in not appearing to try and be illusive or refusing to answer questions on the side of the road...as I always had an asnwer, just not one they wanted to hear.

Happy reading!
Be Blessed.

In Christ,
Greg.

For those using Firefox, the link for Devoted to Truth is:

http://ecclesia.org/truth/

Inside that index is some real meat to chew on at the Lawful Assembly:

http://ecclesia.org/truth/assembly.html

Greg Posted - 01 Oct 2007 : 02:00:34
Greetings Marty, Thomas7, and others.
The answer to your query Marty is here within this site. Not trying to be elusive, but there is a great deal of reading one can and should do in the "resources" area, "Devoted to truth" link.
I believe I've read nearly everything there and it was a great help to me in not appearing to try and be illusive or refusing to answer questions on the side of the road...as I always had an asnwer, just not one they wanted to hear.

Happy reading!
Be Blessed.

In Christ,
Greg.
Thomas7 Posted - 30 Sep 2007 : 15:18:22
Thanks brother Greg for your perspective. I understand it, and it is a good point. The way I see it however, is that the exemption represents the fact I'm not under man's law but rather YHWH's. If they agree (by granting exemption), then fine. If not, or if there were strings attached I'd be forced to go the route you describe.

I'm definitely going to spend some time today reading how to handle "side of the road" encounters, particularly with an eye of what NOT to say. I've read a few dialogs on one section of the board that are rather confrontational. I'd prefer a low key approach, but I suspect we're coming into an era that confrontation will be required to pursue an unenfranchised path through life.

I continually pray YHWH will provide me a way out or a way to deal with these situations, and teach me His wisdom and understanding so I may live in a manor that honors Him.

2Co 3:17 Now YHWH is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of YHWH is, there is freedom.
Cornerstone Foundation Posted - 30 Sep 2007 : 14:37:33
quote:
Originally posted by Greg
...I have already proven to myself in a court room that you can only be tied to the "ALL CAPS, SS account, etc" through your consent, or by another rendering appearance on your behalf (the first appearance is usually made on the side of the road, if it's not done here they will continue in their tricky attempts to get it)...

Be Blessed group.

In Christ,
Greg.



Cornerstone Foundation wrote:

What is the proper way to handle things at the side of the road so that that encounter does not constitute an appearance?

Best Regards,

Marty
Greg Posted - 30 Sep 2007 : 01:09:28
Greetings Thomas and others. I decided not to pursue obtaining an exemption.
I drew the conclusion this whole thing (for me anyway) is about obeying God rather than men...especially under such a corrupt system of man so contradictary to God and his Will/Law(s).
That being said, to ask them for an "exemption", rather granted or denied, is asking them for permission to obey Gods Law(s). This just doesn't sit right with the grain of my being.
So I have no intention of asking them for anything. I have also quit looking for a way they will recognize to back out of the system. I just cast it all aside and don't pick it up or claim any of it. This works fine for me for now, as I have already proven to myself in a court room that you can only be tied to the "ALL CAPS, SS account, etc" through your consent, or by another rendering appearance on your behalf (the first appearance is usually made on the side of the road, if it's not done here they will continue in their tricky attempts to get it).
I find it terribly hard to believe that if I happen to live to see the end of times that I would be able to stand the test and be beheaded for not taking the mark of the beast, if I'll place them before God now just to avoid lossing some freedom from time to time for "driving without a license".
If a mans reply to that is "I have a family to look after", then I emplore you to think about rendering that response when they tell you that you cannot work, nor buy food for your family without the mark.

If a licenses purpose was to insure those on the road did not endager others and / or infringe upon others rights, it would be acceptable (if it didn't require a SS#). But like all things from the gubberment this is merely the fascade it is given to make it appear as if it's in everyones best interest.

Be Blessed group.

In Christ,
Greg.

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