| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| David Merrill |
Posted - 02 Jan 2005 : 15:16:13
These articles from Century Magazine 1928 are amazing.
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Especially the first one about Paul's War by Propaganda ending in an arrogant poem about New York city.quote:
Syncopated city of the lonely blues,
Your avenues
Are dance-halls for my gloating soul.
However, the articles only tell a little about the whole picture.quote:
He [Paul] was on his way to Damascus one day to arrest a group of the sectaries when a novel idea came to him. In the quaint phrase of the Book of Acts he saw a vision...
And when reasoned inductively with The Nazarene Gospel Restored by Robert Graves and Joshua Podro this was actually Shaul trying to collect the bounty on the survived Yehoshuah H'Natzrith who had fled to Damascus to live a refugee's life in the Jewish settlement there.
Another segment I will integrate into the Topic is METRO and the Dutch East Indies Trading Company claim to Manhattan Island through the Freedoms and Exemptions Granted to Patroons charter on that soil. The article from the 1995 American's Bulletin is quite informative and integrates the Protocols of the Meetings of the Learned Elders of Zion.
http://friends-n-family-research.info/FFR/Merrill_METROchapter1.pdf
http://friends-n-family-research.info/FFR/Merrill_METROchapter2.pdf
http://friends-n-family-research.info/FFR/Merrill_METROchapter3.pdf
And that document, the Protocols rounds out the mozaic I am calling the bigger picture. It is obvious that the document was not written by the Jews. That is why Eli Marcus Ravage felt free to ridicule the accusation. Albeit I have seen more than one conspiracy buff quote Ravage out of context as an admission of guilt. The document was originally an internal memorandum of the Priory of Sion, the custodian and directorate of the Bloodline of Jesus Christ. The document was butchered into the anti-Jew accusation by a disgruntled counsellor to the Russian Czar.
The faith of those who believe in the supernatural Resurrection has served quite well in protecting the Bloodline. There seems to be an informed reference to this at the end of Dan Brown's book, The DaVinci Code. Paranoia has always disabled a proper prosecution as if there was one deserved by the responsible custodians throughout banking history. But that is why I include the second article.quote:
All right. For the sake of argument we [Jews] will underwrite every word of it [The Protocols]. It is genuine and authentic. But what is that beside the unquestionable historical conspiracy which we have carried out, which we have never denied because you never had the courage to charge us with it, and of which the full record is extant for anybody to read? ....
and this after opening the first article:quote:
Why throw us a patent and clumsy forgery such as the Protocols of the Elders of Zion when you might as well confront us with the Revelation of St. John? Why talk about Marx and Trotski when you have Jesus of Nazareth and Paul of Tarsus to confound us with?
That is simple. Christians cannot form a proper court on faith. See Hebrews 11:1. Christians are sunk before they begin because they have thrown out Rules of Evidence.
Imported from another Topic is an interesting thought:quote:
Case in Point:
Thirty to forty years ago many who monitor this forum would have considered themselves gay-Christians. Now because of a change in word usage or for other reasons...most know they are not gay and as one can determine by the recent quotes herein many are thinking they may not be Christian either.
I say I am not Christian because as I define Christian, I would have to accept the supernatural Rising from the Dead. I do not. Yet I am certain the Messiah of God spoken of in the Prophecies is that same Jesus of Nazareth. And I am aware that prophecy as a psychometric phenomenon giving prior knowledge of events is calculable.
So for now I hope the link to the zipped image files of the articles will be available even before this Topic is approved by Admin. I think it will stir some wonderful and constructive debate albeit it will rub some people the wrong way. So please be careful to think of where you are directing your more passionate Posts. Are you directing feelings toward the author or the subject matter?
Regards,
David Merrill |
| 20 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Manuel |
Posted - 16 Aug 2005 : 02:28:29
Thank you for the heads-up I.Scriabin,
During the few years on the net, I've heard of
Steve Quayle. The research which caught my attention
was the one about the Grand Canyon artifacts after
spending some time there and not hearing anything of it.
You know, years ago I helped a friend of mine promote a small advertising firm he ventured unto. The promotion consisted of
a give-away box which top had printed on it "Judge Not The Size
- But The Might..." heck... I forgot what was on the inside of
the box now, but you get the drift.
I think that those powers back then where also showing horror
movies to the children so they would be afraid of the dark.
|
| I. Scriabin |
Posted - 15 Aug 2005 : 23:23:03
Manuel, you make a very good point. Yes, the Giants of today will be dealt with at the proper time by on the Great Day of the Almighty One as revealed by the writings of the prophets in The Word.
Indeed, they have expended immense sums in their efforts to create what they believe will be impregnable fortifications in the underground. But like the Giant Goliath will also be made small and headless.
On the topic of Giants - have you heard the Stephen Quayle interviews on Coast to Coast AM? He is quite an expert on Giants of old.
He has an article on the real Giant of today and more about the time of Noah.
Yes, I believe your perceptions are spot on!
|
| Manuel |
Posted - 13 Aug 2005 : 18:09:09
Greetings I. Scriabin,
The boomerangs come and go, just like the BANKING GIANTS and their scheme of things. I relate the story of David knocking off the GIANT with a stone right between the GIANTS eyes. The GIANT probably saw some stars before he collapsed unto the ground. The GIANT was reduced to a midget... sort of like "TATOO" from that tv program Fantasy Island. Did you know that "TATOO" once refurbished an old hotel. Yeap... he built everything to size whereby all other midgets could go and spend some time there. Small doors, beds, chairs etc... The question one man asked TATOO was: "What will you name the hotel," and TATOO answered: "Oh, I'm going to name it - stay free mini-pad." :)
I. Scriabin, what do you think the GIANTS are doing? How about the millions of mans working hours and labours building the GIANTS HEAVY-DUTY BUNKERS? Is that not also prophecy regarding the events of, "hiding behind rocks?"
|
| I. Scriabin |
Posted - 13 Aug 2005 : 01:25:09
Manuel,
You are a man of many interests and talents. Yes, the mysteries of old are
very strange and almost impossible to comprehend.
One wonders what the angels and their hybrid offspring, the nephilim giants, did
during their reign of supremacy over men of the earth in pre-flood times.
They seem to have left some "marks" of their existence for us to puzzle about.
And the prophecies tell us that things on earth will be similar to the time
before the flood as we approach the great day of the Almighty One.
|
| Manuel |
Posted - 26 Apr 2005 : 01:33:05
Greetings to all,
As I searched to pluck this newsletter into a category, I thought it would do well on this one considering it to be another war on propaganda:
ARCHAEOLOGY ANSWERS
NEWS UPDATE
Issue 3
www.archaeologyanswers.com
Welcome to another Archaeology Answers News Update.
Today you and I shall go exploring for ancient mysteries,
boomerangs, a forgotten city… and hair-raising terrain…
from the safety of your home.
That reminds me of the man who said he was a world
traveller… but that it had never cost him a cent. While
others got stressed out racing to travel agents, taxis and
airports, he stayed at home and just let his mind wander!
Anyway, I sincerely trust you will enjoy this collection
of astonishing facts.
So here goes…
This issue includes:
2. Boomerangs in early Africa
3. Ancient power tools
4. Cement we cannot re-produce
5. Ancient underground city
6. Valleys of poison
7. Please tell a friend
8. Tell us what you think
9. Ancient Power tools
-----------------------------------------------------------
1. BOOMERANGS IN EARLY AFRICA
-----------------------------------------------------------
On the western bank of the Nile River, opposite Luxor in
Egypt, is the historic temple of Deir-el-Bahari (the temple
of Queen Hatshepsut).
The Punt gallery in the Southern wing of the middle
colonnade deals with a trading enterprise , in which are
depicted numerous items brought to the Egyptians by the
Puntites. Among these is a pile of boomerangs, one of the
early hunting weapons in Africa.
For the Egyptians this instrument was so “foreign” that the
curved stick became for them the hieroglyphic symbol for
“foreigners” or “foreign lands”.
---------------------------------------------------------------
2. ANCIENT POWER TOOLS
----------------------------------------------------------------
Of course, the ancient Egyptians and others were not supposed
to have had power tools! We are told that they were a
semi-savage people who never really passed beyond the primitive
state of technological development.
This opinion is flatly contradicted by the sophistication of the
Pyramids and cannot even explain how the Egyptians managed
to do such apparently simple things as to DRILL AND SCUPT
HARD STONE.
As long ago as the turn of the 20th century, for example, the
great Scottish Egyptologist Sir William Flinders Petrie was
honest enough to admit that he was puzzled by certain granite
and diorite ‘drill-cores’that he had found at ancient Egyptian
archaeological sites.
It was clear that tubular drills had been used to hollow out
large blocks of these peculiarly hard stones and that the drills
had been turning WITH GREAT FORCE AND SPEED.
The amount of pressure, shown by the rapidity with which the
drills pierced through the hard stone, is very surprising. A
load of at least a ton or two was placed on the 4-inch drills
cutting in granite. On the granite core No. 7, the spiral of
the cut sinks one inch in thecircumference of 6 inches, or one
in 60, a rate of plowing out whichis astonishing.
These rapid spiral grooves cannot be ascribed to anything but
the descent of the drill into the granite under ENORMOUS
PRESSURE.
Just how enormous that pressure may have been was confirmed
by Chris Dunn, an expert machine toolmaker, who rose to a
senior position at Danville Metal Stamp in the U.S.A. His
calculations indicate that the Egyptian drills were turning
“500 times faster than modern power drills.”
So as well as the reliefs and texts of ancient Egypt, there
is hard empirical evidence of the form of the drill cores
which suggests that the ancient Egyptians may have had access
to some sort of as yetunidentified power source which they
harnessed in a variety of ways and for a variety of purposes.
The Hebrews also possessed a most unusual building tool,
accordingto Talmudic-Midrashic traditions. Known as the Shamir,
it was used in the construction of the Temple of Solomon in
Jerusalem.
This device was capable of cutting the toughest materials
“withoutfriction or heat”, it was reportedly “noiseless”, and
could slice through diamonds!
Special precautions surrounded its use: “The shamir may not be
put in an iron vessel for safekeeping, nor in any metal vessel;
it would burst such a receptacle asunder. It is to be kept
wrapped up in a woollen cloth and this in turn is to be placed
in a lead basket filled with barley corn.”
The Shamir was best known by its function as “the stone that
cuts rocks”, though it was often also referred to as a “worm”
or a “serpent”.
Judaic tradition directly associates the Shamir with Moses.
- Graham Hancock, in Daily Mail
-------------------------------------------------------------
3. CEMENT WE CANNOT RE-PRODUCE
-------------------------------------------------------------
The Great pyramid of Giza in Egypt had sides totalling 5 ¼
acres, finished off like glass, and took on the appearance of
an immense mirror, whose reflections could be seen for more
than 50 miles (80 kilometers). The visible surfaces were
worked as accurately as modern opticians’ work
(Today tourists can see only blocks of rough-looking stone,
rising as in steps; the Arabs have stripped the building of its
outer casing for use in other buildings in Cairo.)
The stone blocks of the Great pyramid were joined together
with cement which was painted on like paint.
Modern chemists can analyse this cement, but are UNABLE
TO PRODUCE IT.
Yet, this cement, as thin as a sheet of tissue paper, can hold
a vertical joint as large as 5 feet by 7 feet in area.
The cement is so tough that the limestone blocks will break
before the cement gives way. So fine is the join that a
photograph fails to reveal it.
---------------------------------------------------------------
4. ANCIENT UNDERGROUND CITY
----------------------------------------------------------------
Edith Breeden has ported to me from California that in the early
1970s she and her husband were visiting Spain. They were taken
to a site that had been “discovered” by a teenager from Rota,
Spain, and he offered to show it to them.
She recalls, “I had never seen anything like it before – or since.
Located near the town of Jerez de la Frontera on property
belonging to a private company was an underground city. (?)
It was entered by a large opening much like the mouth of a cave.
Some poor (?) people appeared to be camping there. We were
led by the young man inside to what he said was the top floor
of a 3-floor city (area).
“We did not venture any further, knowing he and his teenager
friends had been lost in there for 3 days before finding their
way out.
“We heard the area was to be flooded in order to keep others
from going in – to prevent accidents. But leaving Spain, we
don’t actually know what was done.”
--------------------------------------------------------------
5. VALLEYS OF POISON
--------------------------------------------------------------
Among the curious places on our planet, the horrifying poison
Valleys of Java in Indonesia are to many unknown.
The celebrated valley poison, Gueva upas, is an extinct crater
about half a mile in circumference, which is an object of terror
to the inhabitants of the region. Every living thing which
penetrates into this valley falls down dead. The bottom is
covered with bones and carcases of tigers, deer, birds and even
of men – all killed by the copious emanations of carbonic acid
gas. Accumulating in the hollow, it forms an invisible but
deadly lake.
In another crater, near the volcano of Talaga Bodas, something
different happens. Here there are sulfurous exhalations, which
have killed tigers, birds and innumerable insects. But in this
case the soft parts, such as muscle, nails, hair and skin, are
preserved – while bones are corroded and destroyed.
========================================
The above reports are an update to the best-seller Dead
Men’s Secrets – surprising discoveries in lost cities of
the dead. Seafloor, jungle and desert sands give up a
thousand forgotten secrets. Technology that vanished.
For a copy of this amazing book, with six valuable
FREE bonuses, go now to
http://www.archaeologyanswers.com
========================================
6. PLEASE TELL A FRIEND
------------------------------------------------------------
Did you enjoy this News Update?
You are welcome to put it on your own website –
exactly as it is, without change, including our email
address.
If you know someone who would find these facts
interesting, Click the URL below now to email it to them,
or copy and paste the URL below into your browser.
http://www.archaeologyanswers.com/email/popupform_recommend.html
A form will instantly pop up for you to email it to them.
------------------------------------------------------------
7. TELL US WHAT YOU THINK!
------------------------------------------------------------
We would love to hear what you think of this
issue of “Archaeology Answers News Update.” And
of course, if you have any suggestions for future issues
that you would like to share with us, please send
those too!
Just e-mail the editor at:
info@archaeologyanswers.com
=======================================
If you have received this mailing in error, or do not
wish to receive any further newsletter mailings from
us, simply click “Reply” and type “unsubscribe”.
|
| David Merrill |
Posted - 26 Mar 2005 : 19:33:39
True North;
You might be surprised at how welcome your Post is, at least by myself. You close with:quote:
"The man who doubts the possibility of correct historical evidence and tradition cannot then accept his own evidence, judgment, combination and interpretation. He cannot limit his doubt to his historical criticism, but is required to let it operate on his own life. He discovers at once that he not only lacks conclusive evidence in all sorts of aspects of his own life that he had quite taken for granted, but also that there is no evidence whatever. In short, he finds himself forced to accept a general philosophical skepticism along with his historical skepticism. And general philosophical skepticism is a nice intellectual game, but one cannot live by it".
"Historical study has become a powerful instrument in the service of the anti-supernaturalistic spirit of the modern age. Professing to be strictly neutral and to seek nothing but the truth it has in point of fact directed its assault along the whole line against the outstanding miraculous events of ... history. It has rewritten this history so as to make the supernatural elements disappear from its record. It has called into question the historicity of one after the other of the great redemptive acts of God. We need not say here that the apologetic answer to these attacks has been able and fully satisfactory to every believer."
I have read this two or three times and cannot grasp who the author is?
Regards,
David Merrill. |
| Manuel |
Posted - 21 Mar 2005 : 22:54:36
quote:
Originally posted by charles8854
> Greetings charles,
Greetings Manuel,
> Thank you for your like-minded response.
cbs#: Ditto; my friend.
> You know... remember the written words where Yashua tells Peter:
Get behind me satan..."?
Yes; i know.
There does come a time to tell fellow travelers to either
get with the real program or consider parting company.
I presume that is what you are referencing.
> FYI... I, to this day have not received a written response to
The Written Bill of Particulars I demanded years ago.
Making them, fraudulent by Nihil Dicit.
Demands for "Bill of Particulars" seems to me to be more powewrful than the non-statutoiry abatements.
Tho they surely can work together; with the abatments following default on the demand for the bop.
Your case seems familiar.
Have we discussed that case in times past?
Glory to Yhvh;
cbs ...
charles@christiancommonlaw-gov.org
Greetings Charles,
The reasoning I wrote of Yashua's demand to Peter is because much of that rebuke still happens to this day. As the words goes... "Evil is evil"
Throughout history many have been betrayed by their own followers when the going gets tough. I recall Watt Tylers rebellion. I recall when "a follower" denied Him thrice. Many brag about having "black belts" and different kinds of TITLES, but having His Truth around ones neck is glorious.
As far as the "Bill of Particulars," Fathers works and Will are unconventional, therefore mightier than any conventional method of this world.
I thank you Charles, for your concern and comfort.
I am, In Him,
Manuel |
| True North |
Posted - 21 Mar 2005 : 13:18:40
Greetings all
Change of heart, i.e. perspective, allows me to crawl back out of my hole and address this forum by holding the presumption that 'truth', (see John 18:38), is the desire and motive of the participants of this forum.
Caveat; the Spirit of 'truth' cannot adequately be expressed in words, (babble - chatter or Babel - a place or circumstance in which the confusion of sounds is the predominating characteristic). The semantics and opinions expressed in these interactions are an expression of the sum of each individual's study and observation, consequently, the opinions are not and cannot be 'truth' in that no one of us ... "dwelleth all the fulness" ...
History, specifically ecclesiastical history, prejudices my own opinions. Various "authorities" on the subject of 'critical evaluation of history' and 'higher biblical criticism' are available, (higher biblical criticism dates to the late 1600's, I will not subject my peers to the evaluation of the same unless addressed), but know that biblical context will not allow criticism that teaches a "Pauline Christianity". The origin(s) of Christianity, as a separate sect or apart from historic Judaism, is untenable. Likewise, pacifism is a concept born of ignorance of Jewish concepts and a distortion of Berit HaDashah.
Pacifism is quite contrary to self defense in anticipation of peril and is also not tenable. The example of the Hebrew concept of chutzpah (Luke 18:5 ... "Yet because this widow troubleth me, I will avenge her, lest by her continual coming she weary me ...) is distorted by translating 'meek' in ... "Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth" ... with pacifism instead of anah (06030) and chutzpah.
Simple scientific method must be applied in exploring any area of ignorance and no less in exegesis. I am not going to explain scientific method to my peers and insult their intelligence. History is also viewed by many as opinion and rejected in their evaluation of the context of Pauline letters and subjectively the ideology that rejects biblical context is not without some merit, given the 1611 distortion of Yeshua HaNazarit and the Kingdom in the Berit HaDasha, (new testament). The notorious Kingdom ideology is distorted by the fact that none have gathered the evidences in a comprehensive package completely void of prejudice. (Kant said void of prejudice was not possible in interpretation of evidence - my paraphrase Ed).
Easton's Bible Dictionary tells us that the Herodians were "a Jewish political party", while Webster's 1828 Dictionary tells us that they were "a sect among the Jews", thus demonstrating, for the brothers and sisters here, that a sect is a political party. Now, if we put that knowledge together with this verse of the Scripture we begin to see the light. Act 24:5 For we have found this man a pestilent fellow, and a mover of sedition among all the Jews throughout the world, and a ringleader of the sect of the Nazarenes ... quoting from the writings of oneisraelite on page 6 of 'Expatriation - the Remedy?'
History, specifically ecclesiastical history, recorded by Phillip Schaff and others but relating to the above quote, as recorded by Gibbons in Vol.1 180 A.D. - 395 A.D. of 'The Rise and Fall of the Roman Empire' on page 390 lends some perspective to the confusion of the term Nazarenes and the ideology known as the 'new covenant'. The following contains a brief discussion of "Pauline Christianity" also.
The Nazarenes retired from the ruins of Jerusalem to the little town of Pella beyond the Jordan, where that ancient church languished above sixty years in solitude and obscurity ... They elected Marcus for their bishop ... (a deviation from the commands given - see Matthew 23:10-11 and Luke 22:25 -editor), ... At his persuasion the most considerable part of the congregation renounced the Mosaic law, in the practice of which they had persevered above a century. By this sacrifice of their habits and prejudices they purchased a free admission into the colony of Hadrian, and more firmly cemented their union with the Catholic Church ...
As an attempt to keep this from becoming a diatribe, the term 'new covenant' embraces the "one new ideology"* introduced by Yeshua and recorded in Mark 16:15 "... Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature" ... *("one new ideology" meaning something new added to the notorious Kingdom as handed down from generation to generation historically either oral or written to His people). Any opinion rendered "outside" of this one new concept, regarding the doctrines of Christianity, is prone to error. The logic is as follows: Almost every epistle of the Berit HaDashah is written in correction to Gentile churches that are not steeped in 4000 years of Jewish culture. The implications 'should' be obvious ... these distortions, in the Gentile churches, were cultural and had to be addressed to avoid government by man. The distortions were addressed under James 1:25 which has its corollary in Genesis 1:25-26.
Both Gentile and Jewish churches were formed under the newly proclaimed King, (Yeshua), alongside existing churches proclaiming no king but Caesar and Gentile churches proclaiming every god/king under the sun. The servant leaders of these 'newly proclaimed King' churches addressed the needs of this original, yet continuation of the notorious Kingdom, first churches established under the new King, nearly cultural specific Jewish churches. Gentile churches were formed as Gentiles proclaiming the King multiplied.
Ignorance of the nature of Him and the nature of man, as well as import of cultural, Gentile practices into these Gentile churches abounded. The distortions in these Gentile churches is what Paul/Shaul addresses in his letters to the churches. Some of these distortions and the addressing of the same are recorded in the book of Acts and record the lawyer Paul/Shaul correcting the Jewish servant leaders in their own distortions, (of address of these problems), held over from Judaist prejudice that were contrary to James 1:25. Paul/Shaul did not start a new religion called Christianity that promoted doctrine different from the original, and therefore notorious, ideal of the Kingdom in its conception and evolution under the proclamation of Deuteronomy 6:4.
To clarify this statement, leave aside the semantics of what is a Jew and what is a Gentile and render these definitions for the time being; Jew - One whose history, study and culture encompasses Deuteronomy 6:4 and all of its implications in each ones' own individual capacity of obligation to the same. A Gentile is anyone or everyone else of whatever cultural education.
There is nothing new introduced in the 'new testament' or "Pauline Christianity" that sets the same apart or in contradistinction to/from the introduction of the Kingdom of Yah. The Kingdom is now available to any and all who will accept the new King, (the paradoxically notorious Kingdom from the Kingdoms' foundation, see Matthew 13:35, 25:34, Hebrews 4:3, Revelation 13:8, 17:8). Heretofore this same Kingdom was for Jews only with one god ideology, (in all of its distortions of kingship), denoted in Deuteronomy 6:4. Any supposed "new" concept in the 'new testament' has a corollary in the 'old covenant/testament' and any interpretation differing from that corollary may contain a distortion of that concept.
He does not change ... Malachi 3:6 ... (I do not address change/breaking of covenant(s) here). Law is a synonym for part of the nature of the Spirit that dwells in all living creatures and Law does not change. "Supposed law" that changes, (juxtaposed evolution of law), is an ordinance or statute, not Law.
"Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many Citizens, because of respect for the law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their rights due to ignorance." U.S v.Minker, 350 U.S. 179, 187. I digress but keep the context of Deuteronomy 6:4 irrespective of atheism's views of law in its evolution holding the maxim that Law, (a synonym remember), is simple and understandable by the average man or it is not Law....
There have been challenges to the corollary idea of an 'old testament' original, and all fail, given context. This includes challenges to the concept of "resurrection" and "virgin birth". Ineffable word enthusiast type of challenges are not honorable and usually void of context.
Basic to understanding the nature of Him and the nature of man is understanding blood. Bloodline, in a hierarchical governmental context, is a distortion of Genesis 1:26 and specifically verse 27. There is specific rendering of the Hebrew of these verses contained in some of my earliest posts to this forum.
Identity in Him requires a "line to be drawn" between making a name, Genesis 11:4, and identity that comes because of the nature of Yah. That identity is tied or anchored to blood and the recognition of that blood allows me to identify my nature and the nature of my fellow man. Not because of bloodline but because of the nature of Him and "what is life" (see Genesis 9:4, Leviticus 17:14).
I apologize for just 'touching' too many diverse subjects in this post. It is extremely frustrating to deal with 'intellectual' reasoning void of context that also rejects evidence that is supra-naturalistic.
The supra-naturalistic stance promoted by the world allows the definition of historic to be; ... that which occurs naturally, anything that occurs in nature.
"The man who doubts the possibility of correct historical evidence and tradition cannot then accept his own evidence, judgment, combination and interpretation. He cannot limit his doubt to his historical criticism, but is required to let it operate on his own life. He discovers at once that he not only lacks conclusive evidence in all sorts of aspects of his own life that he had quite taken for granted, but also that there is no evidence whatever. In short, he finds himself forced to accept a general philosophical skepticism along with his historical skepticism. And general philosophical skepticism is a nice intellectual game, but one cannot live by it".
"Historical study has become a powerful instrument in the service of the anti-supernaturalistic spirit of the modern age. Professing to be strictly neutral and to seek nothing but the truth it has in point of fact directed its assault along the whole line against the outstanding miraculous events of ... history. It has rewritten this history so as to make the supernatural elements disappear from its record. It has called into question the historicity of one after the other of the great redemptive acts of God. We need not say here that the apologetic answer to these attacks has been able and fully satisfactory to every believer."
TN |
| David Merrill |
Posted - 21 Mar 2005 : 11:52:25
Taking a closer look at your domain name Charles Bruce. I just realized what an oxymoron Christian Common Law is since all people are not Christian. So you are talking about a law common to Christians, Yes?
I believe that you should read the Ravage articles at least so you know what the argument is about Christianity being fashioned by Paul into the weapon against Rome. |
| charles8854 |
Posted - 21 Mar 2005 : 01:59:52
> Greetings charles,
Greetings Manuel,
> Thank you for your like-minded response.
cbs#: Ditto; my friend.
> You know... remember the written words where Yashua tells Peter:
Get behind me satan..."?
Yes; i know.
There does come a time to tell fellow travelers to either
get with the real program or consider parting company.
I presume that is what you are referencing.
> FYI... I, to this day have not received a written response to
The Written Bill of Particulars I demanded years ago.
Making them, fraudulent by Nihil Dicit.
Demands for "Bill of Particulars" seems to me to be more powewrful than the non-statutoiry abatements.
Tho they surely can work together; with the abatments following default on the demand for the bop.
Your case seems familiar.
Have we discussed that case in times past?
Glory to Yhvh;
cbs ...
charles@christiancommonlaw-gov.org |
| Manuel |
Posted - 20 Mar 2005 : 20:54:42
Greetings charles,
Thank you for your like-minded response.
You know... remember the written words where Yashua tells Peter:
Get behind me satan..."?
FYI... I, to this day have not received a written response to The Written Bill of Particulars I demanded years ago. Making them, fraudulent by Nihil Dicit. |
| charles8854 |
Posted - 19 Mar 2005 : 06:12:41
<snip>
>You said:
Quote: That sounds right, but I am not aware of any evidence in its support. I like Maccabees, very much. Eisenman discussed them a lot.
> And it is within your right to decree the Book of Macabees does not meet Rules of Evidence in your court.
cbs#: Maccabees does meet the rules of evidence in my court.
I allow satan him-self into my court, at least so long as he maintains a non-disruptive posture.
It is for the conscience-bound Jury of my court, to decide the Merits of the Evidence presented from any such as these.
> That the canonizing "out" of Macabees was divinely inspired to preserve the infallibility of the written word.
cbs#: I believe I detect “Sarcasm” in your choice of the words: “divinely inspired to preserve the infallibility of the written word”. I find sarcasm a very inefficient mode of communication, good sir; especially in these sterile written-text-based discussion forums.
But to your sarcastically communicated point; yes, Maccabees was “canonized out” by the romanist slave-traders for the express purpose of eliminating all dissenting texts from the general theme of “Pacifism” as communicated through the approved texts.
>But keep in mind that it is found in all the mainstream Holy Bibles until just recently.
cbs#: I knew the catholic bible included some of it; but I was unaware of any protestant bibles including it.
>And said:
Quote: Perhaps you feel similarly, but just chose your words poorly; Yes?
> I think the term "lost his temper" is interpreted differently between us.
cbs#: Apparently so.
>He may have not lost emotional control. A tempered man would have utilized administrative and judicial recourse available.
cbs#: Imho, & at that point, Yeshuah had “Exhausted” the “Judicial Resources Available” (“administrative” was not practiced by Israelites, imho); & the “Pathway of Peace” had become completely Exhausted with them; & there-under it was then “Lawful” (under applicable Torah/Law), to “Administer Force” in efforts to “Keep the Peace” against those conspiratorial plunderers of the wealth of the common Israelite people & the treasury of the temple of Yhvh.
> That being the priest/Herodians frustrated that so Jesus began overturning tables.
cbs#: Jesus/Yeshuah Never Violated Higher Torah/Law; imho. Even under modern american constitutional common-law, it is lawful to take up arms to arrest corrupted public-servants & bankers. This is the entire Purpose behind “Why” Jesus/Yeshuah Assembled “Twelve Followers”, so that His Kingship over the Nation of Israel might be “Lawfully” Established.
> Also there seems plenty of precedent that other zealots in the crowd were watching to see what happened to Jesus before they were going to act.
cbs#: The Maccabees account, as well as various orthodox biblical-texts; all bear witness to support the proposition that the old testament “Zealots” were Not mere opportunistic bystanders. We are discussing a Militaristically-Organized community of able-bodied & religiously-Zealous men here. They were the Followers of the Promised Messiah of Israel, sir. I find it incomprehensible to imagine that their presence at his routing of the money-changers from the temple was anything less than in an “Active” Role.
> And thus supporting my theory that the commercial interference was a great factor in hanging Jesus. The Herodians saw they must make a stern example of him.
cbs#: I would not object to your proposition that: “the commercial interference was a great factor in hanging Jesus”. That can merge well with my larger concern for the lawless shedding of the blood of the common people of our Israelite nation.
> That's right. I had not factored in how Jesus must have felt about John being beheaded by the Herodians.
cbs#: Thank you.
>Anyway that would support that he was furious.
cbs#: “Fury” can be throttled & calculated; ie: brought to bear in an entirely “Lawful” manner.
I hate to nit-pick, but it is of ut-most importance in my mind that “Law” be up-held in every action which our mentor Jesus/Yeshuah accomplished. I have liberal friends who claim to be “Anarchists”. I stretch our friendship to its limits when they refuse to acknowledge the supremacy of godly/natural “Law”. I then just go ballistic; & rightfully so, imho; just as did my mentor, Jesus/Yeshuah, in the very case which we are discussing, (as well as others).
>And:
Quote: I think Saul/Paul “Fabricated” the Entire Event [encounter with Jesus Christ].
> Maybe you are right.
cbs#: Thank you.
> I do not choose to attribute that much imagination to Paul's strategy of War by Propaganda.
cbs#: Saul/paul had much help. The entire Herodian dynasty, as well as the romanist empire’s continued strangle-hold on the nation of Israel, depended on his work. And they all knew it, & undoubtably assisted him in the development of his subversive plans, as well as their implementation.
> I like to think there is usually some real events in the middle of such significant cusps in human history.
cbs#: If that was the only factor, yes. But the clear interests of the larger romanist/herodian slave-trading babylonian-whore community; seems to me to weigh-in powerfully in the opposite direction.
> The Nazarene Gospel Restored gives some substantial argument that Saul was a bounty hunter hired to marry into the Herodians on the Temple for payment.
cbs#: Very interesting. I have not seen that text. I looked it up on amazon, used copies are going for from 94 to 100 bable-bucks. That is beyond my means. Saul/paul being a “bounty-hunter, seems quite in harmony with his general karma.
> Bringing the survived Jesus to a complete public death was a priority.
cbs#: Agreed.
> Maybe that priority was set by Paul's report of how the Messiah rumors were so very compatible with the Roman/Greco pagan beliefs (rebirth/virgin birth) in Celicia and the entirety of Asia Minor?
cbs#: Maybe. I have not explored that aspect of the conspiracy far. It seems of minor concern to the larger issues, in my mind.
> I am not clear what you point out about Romanists and force. Maybe my point about Paul designing a weapon - War by Propaganda?
cbs#: Well, I was not focused directly on your subject-header. From my studies of “Common-Law” the Use of “Force” is Only Allowed in those few & very rare circumstances when the “Pathway of Peace” has become Exhausted. And because Common-Law is Derived from Israelite/Christian/Torah-Law, I find it reasonable to infer that these very same principles were being practiced during the times of our Messiah.
I have studied much on all of this, & I would enjoy communicating my knowledge to you, because you obviously have similar treasures of knowledge. I have now sent you 2 emails asking for phone discussion; but I have received no response. I respectfully suggest that a phone discussion between we two would save us both a whole lot of key-strokes.
> Before I go into a new treatise I will try to clarify what I meant about the "nasty" Jews being the Apostles. Try reading the Book of Acts this way. The Jews who were adamantly trying to kill Paul were actually James' judicial team of Ebionites (leading many other religious Jews).
cbs#: I am thin on the term “Ebonites”, although I am inclined to believe it a valid term. Other-wise your words sound correct.
> When Paul returned to Jerusalem he was not only warned from doing so
cbs#: I have not seen any evidence of a warning for saul/paul to not go to Jerusalem, sir.
> but little word had reached Jerusalem about the heretical teachings he was preaching in Asia Minor. There was only a Cypriot Jew named Mnason to contradict that he had steered clear of Cyprus (and bought his expensive Roman citizenship papers out of alms intended for the Ebionite missionaries' "widows").
cbs#: Interesting.
> Now imagine as testimony caught up with Paul. More people coming into Jerusalem who had seen Paul and heard about what he was teaching in Asia Minor. Now James was feeling duped into believing Paul because he had shaved his head and cleansed himself lawfully for a week.
cbs#: Well, I suppose such is possible. But through reading Eisenman’s “James, the Brother of Jesus”; it seems very probably that James was in the control of a very efficient intelligence-gathering network, that he was fully aware of saul/paul’s negative impact on their true christian/israelite work; & that saul/paul had very little chance of “duping” James.
Also, there is another explanation for the head-shaving, fasting, cleansing activities of saul/paul. This is that James had set a “Penance for Sins” Requirement on saul/paul, & saul/paul had accepted. But as the spiritual cleansing process of fasting in the temple took its natural course, saul/paul made choices to embrace evil/demonic spirit-forces. I think it was Baigent/Leigh’s work which partially explored this idea, but it could have been Eisenman.
> So the Bible fails to vilify the Apostles and the reading through the Gospels gives the Christian reader the impression that the Jews after Paul in the Book of Acts were the same Jews that called for the Crucifixion.
cbs#: Yea. Ok. I see what you are saying (after re-reading it 3 times). Agreed.
> Maybe so but James and the other law-abiding Apostles were among only the Book of Acts' Jews, after Paul's death.
cbs#: mmm; there was a powerful pharisee/herodian faction, up until the ad-66 revenge for the beheading of James, & the beginning of the “Jewish Revolution”; where-in the herodian king was slain (by the Torah-Zealous Followers of both James & Jesus/Yeshuah).
But your general-point is well-taken; that James & the torah-law obedient Jews were very prominent at that stage of events.
> My treatise is on your mention of prolific writings destroyed by Romanist book-burners. I remember a short-lived fantasy show called Rage. I only saw the latter half of about the fourth episode. It did not catch my attention at the time but this episode did.
> There was an epistle in a leather case and Romans were after it to destroy it. People were getting killed over it and it fell in the hands of a Christian girl who befriended the pagans. A few pagans decided to help her get the epistle to a repository (she was apparently led divinely) and the pagans consulted a wiseman in the form of an eight year old boy. Careful writing revealed the boy was wise beyond his years and declared the epistle very powerful and all expense must be made to get it to the repository.
> There was entry of Longinus, the Roman who stabbed Jesus on the Cross. He was the tough warrior-hero. It seemed he must help with the mission in order to die a human death - him being about 380 years old by now. Very entertaining.
> The epistle turned out to be the Book of James. The repository was divinely protected and when the Romans converged on it they were destroyed and the little old librarian was quite pleased with the new addition.
> I tuned in the next week and nothing. I heard no more about that series Rage. I was very disappointed. Sometimes I wonder how I could get hold of the few episodes in existence.
cbs#: Interesting. I did some quick web-searching on it. I found nothing also.
How about that phone discussion?
Godspeed;
charles bruce, stewart
503-668-3932
> Regards,
> David Merrill. |
| David Merrill |
Posted - 18 Mar 2005 : 08:47:23
About the failed links: I have figured a way, if I get the file name in proper form, to make it easier to get it working and this means I can Post the link as soon as I think of it. But it takes a couple days before the link functions.
You said:
quote:
That sounds right, but I am not aware of any evidence in its support. I like Maccabees, very much. Eisenman discussed them a lot.
And it is within your right to decree the Book of Macabees does not meet Rules of Evidence in your court. That the canonizing "out" of Macabees was divinely inspired to preserve the infallibility of the written word. But keep in mind that it is found in all the mainstream Holy Bibles until just recently.
And said:
quote:
Perhaps you feel similarly, but just chose your words poorly; Yes?
I think the term "lost his temper" is interpreted differently between us. He may have not lost emotional control. A tempered man would have utilized administrative and judicial recourse available. That being the priest/Herodians frustrated that so Jesus began overturning tables. Also there seems plenty of precedent that other zealots in the crowd were watching to see what happened to Jesus before they were going to act. And thus supporting my theory that the commercial interference was a great factor in hanging Jesus. The Herodians saw they must make a stern example of him.
That's right. I had not factored in how Jesus must have felt about John being beheaded by the Herodians. Anyway that would support that he was furious.
And:
quote:
I think Saul/Paul “Fabricated” the Entire Event [encounter with Jesus Christ].
Maybe you are right. I do not choose to attribute that much imagination to Paul's strategy of War by Propaganda. I like to think there is usually some real events in the middle of such significant cusps in human history. The Nazarene Gospel Restored gives some substantial argument that Saul was a bounty hunter hired to marry into the Herodians on the Temple for payment. Bringing the survived Jesus to a complete public death was a priority. Maybe that priority was set by Paul's report of how the Messiah rumors were so very compatible with the Roman/Greco pagan beliefs (rebirth/virgin birth) in Celicia and the entirety of Asia Minor?
I am not clear what you point out about Romanists and force. Maybe my point about Paul designing a weapon - War by Propaganda?
Before I go into a new treatise I will try to clarify what I meant about the "nasty" Jews being the Apostles. Try reading the Book of Acts this way. The Jews who were adamantly trying to kill Paul were actually James' judicial team of Ebionites (leading many other religious Jews). When Paul returned to Jerusalem he was not only warned from doing so but little word had reached Jerusalem about the heretical teachings he was preaching in Asia Minor. There was only a Cypriot Jew named Mnason to contradict that he had steered clear of Cyprus (and bought his expensive Roman citizenship papers out of alms intended for the Ebionite missionaries' "widows"). Now imagine as testimony caught up with Paul. More people coming into Jerusalem who had seen Paul and heard about what he was teaching in Asia Minor. Now James was feeling duped into believing Paul because he had shaved his head and cleansed himself lawfully for a week.
So the Bible fails to vilify the Apostles and the reading through the Gospels gives the Christian reader the impression that the Jews after Paul in the Book of Acts were the same Jews that called for the Crucifixion. Maybe so but James and the other law-abiding Apostles were among only the Book of Acts' Jews, after Paul's death.
My treatise is on your mention of prolific writings destroyed by Romanist book-burners. I remember a short-lived fantasy show called Rage. I only saw the latter half of about the fourth episode. It did not catch my attention at the time but this episode did.
There was an epistle in a leather case and Romans were after it to destroy it. People were getting killed over it and it fell in the hands of a Christian girl who befriended the pagans. A few pagans decided to help her get the epistle to a repository (she was apparently led divinely) and the pagans consulted a wiseman in the form of an eight year old boy. Careful writing revealed the boy was wise beyond his years and declared the epistle very powerful and all expense must be made to get it to the repository.
There was entry of Longinus, the Roman who stabbed Jesus on the Cross. He was the tough warrior-hero. It seemed he must help with the mission in order to die a human death - him being about 380 years old by now. Very entertaining.
The epistle turned out to be the Book of James. The repository was divinely protected and when the Romans converged on it they were destroyed and the little old librarian was quite pleased with the new addition.
I tuned in the next week and nothing. I heard no more about that series Rage. I was very disappointed. Sometimes I wonder how I could get hold of the few episodes in existence.
Regards,
David Merrill.
|
| charles8854 |
Posted - 18 Mar 2005 : 04:15:01
David;
Thank you for your extensive response to my post.
The links you included there-in, would not come up for me.
You said:
*****************
>In II Macabees Chapter 3 we find the components of a monetary contraction.
>Quote: Now when the holy city was inhabited with all peace, and the laws were kept very well, because of the godliness of Onias the high priest, and his hatred of wickedness, it came to pass that even the kings themselves did honour the place, and magnify the temple with their best gifts; insomuch that Seleucus, king of Asia, of his own revenues bare all the costs belonging to the service of the sacrifices.
> I will carefully explain the mechanics of this early "Franchise". The moneychangers were licensed by the Herodians in Jesus' day.
cbs: That sounds right, but I am not aware of any evidence in its support. I like Maccabees, very much. Eisenman discussed them a lot.
> They probably paid on a percentage or maybe a purchased license. We have evidence that the Herodians were however operating the sacrifices with foreign currencies by donation. However the moneychangers were selling the Temple Tax half-shekel or drachma at an inflated price to the pilgrims under the illusion that only the drachma or shekel was acceptable currency.
cbs: Agreed:
> Think this through a bit. The Herodians, being that they accepted donations were probably hoarding the shekel and drachma coins. Contraction. That means the "proper" currency was intentionally being made scarce. A pilgrim would travel all that way for the holiday and then discover he must pay an inflated price to buy the "proper coin" to honor God's laws about Temple Tax. It gets me riled just writing about it.
cbs: Agreed, on all points.
> Imagine what a righteous Jew of the time would think, seeing the injustice in that. Reading my historical scenario into the Gospels am since convinced it was that act above all things, overturning the moneychangers' tables, disrupting commerce that got Jesus hung on the Cross.
cbs: uuuuuummmmmmm; maybe. It certainly was a major part of the reason behind the crucifiction. I prefer to think in the common-law terms of “initiation of force” & “breach of the peace”; as opposed to the “Commercial” concerns. At the point where he turned over the tables of the money-changers, there was a merger of these concerns; ie: commerce was impacted by the justified use of common-law physical-force by the messiah/christ.
Surely his effort in turning over the tables of the moneychangers was laying the ground-work for a Regimen Change; for with-out their babylonian-whore “Commerce”, they could no longer finance their mercenary army to protect the holding of the kingly & temple offices by the corrupted Herodians & priesthood.
So, I suppose you are correct, in what seems to me to be a kind of indirect way.
> The Bible indicates he acted alone against many.
cbs: This is an important pont for me. I like to think the Twelve Apostles were his “Jury”, who “Justified” his acts, under applicable (but modernly obscure) “Torah-Law”, as he proceeded publicly with such force. I admit there is little (if any) documentation in support of this, but to me it makes very good sense. Especially in the light of the work of Eisenman & other reputable scholars who document that James & the others were “Zealots” for the un-written (lex-non-scripta) Principles of the “Torah-Law”. Here-under, Jesus/Yeshuah would have only been “Proceeding in a Lawful Manner” Against the DeFacto/Herodian Usurpers of the Kingly & Priestly Offices.
> So therefore there were not a lot of zealots in the Temple yard that day.
I do not believe that the lex-scripta biblical-text indicates one way or the other on that matter, good sir.
I find it hard to comprehend that he would take-on a whole crowd of babylonian-whore merchants, with-out availing himself of the support of the very followers whom he had so painfully worked to organize for supporting his work And the romanists who re-wrote the scriptures to reflect the romanist/babylonian agenda, would certainly have purged any such historical records, because it would have served as a model for future natural-born leaders to follow in rousing the common people to throw-of the shackles of the romanist-orchestrated slavery.
> Jesus lost his temper
cbs: I do not think the messiah/christ ever allowed his emotions to get out of his own control.
If you have read such apocrypha as the “Essene Gospel of Peace” ( i know its authenticity is controverted, but it rings true to me); you would see powerful argument for how the “Fasting process” ( which even the bible agrees he did) mellows the mind & spirit to the point that the emotions are never so powerful as to extend beyond the control of the follower of the path-way.
I think Jesus/Yeshua knew what he was going to do before he did it, while he was doing it, & after he had done it. Perhaps you feel similarly, but just chose your words poorly; Yes?
> and was not really acting on any doctrine other than simple justice
cbs: “Simple Justice” Is The Supreme “Doctrine”; good sir. (Well, at least according to the lex-non-scripta spiritual-side of the Torah/Law.)
>of monetary tribute to God.
cbs: Again; I believe that there were more powerful motivating concerns in the mind & heart of the messiah/christ when he over-turned the tables of the money-changers. I think the Blood of John the Baptist &/or the many other martyrs who proceeded him, was of greater concern than the monetary factors (even considering that the money was devoted to Yhvh).
<snip>
>We find a faction ready to make Paul shave his head and show honor to the Law even on rumors that he was teaching grace had replaced the Law in Asia Minor. Then presumably that same faction cause Paul to lower himself out a window by rope, running for his life. Later we see a starvation pact to kill Paul for such Temple-defiling doctrine.
cbs: Agreed. I think James was not inherently opposed to them; but was perhaps throttling them, until the “pathway of peace” had become exhausted; through Paul/Saul’s eventual “Flaking-Out” on the Penance he was suppose to accomplish (probably in repentance for his sins).
>You also said:
Quote: The point is, that there is substantial extra-biblical/hard-historical evidence that the followers of Jesus/Yeshua were Not “Pacifists”.
> And here I think we may be looking at two distinct factions.
cbs: Absolutely. It was all very polarized. There was no room for “fence sitters”.
> The Pauline heresy promulgated through Roman/Greco pagan syncrotism of virgin birth and resurrection. And the other, closer to home was James and the Apostles who knew Jesus. Unlike Paul who only had one encounter with the survived Jesus on the Road to Damascus.
cbs: I question that. I think Saul/Paul “Fabricated” the Entire Event. In Both of the texts of Eisenman (James the Brother of Jesus) & Baigent/Leigh (Dead Sea-Scrolls Deception); much ink is devoted to exploring such propositions.
> Paul indeed taught passivism.
cbs: Except when the roman slave-traders were doing it.
Under Pauline Doctrine, the Romanists were Allowed the use of Force, but the Israelite-Slaves were Not Allowed the Use of Force. (Im sure you meant that; just a point of clarification, showing more of Paul/Sauls Hypocrisy.)
<snip>
>Considering that the Apostles were free to speak and teach, so they had no motivation to write letters. Paul had them outgunned on the face of human history with all those epistles.
cbs: I am inclined to believe that there were many written texts produces by the apostles. Paul was a prolific writer, & his romanist-sponsors may have even used ghost writers. I think it likely that the many texts produced by the apostles were burned by the romanist slave-traders with probably 98 to 99 % efficiency; and that is Why saul/paul dominates modern christian scholarship. Those romanist slave-traders had a powerfully efficient military-machine doing their bidding in stomping-out the last remnants of godly theocratic government on this earth. The “dead sea scrolls”, the “nag hammurabi” texts; & multiple other “apocrypha” have (at least partially) miraculously survived the romanist book-burners. Much can be learned from these texts, imho; especially as pre-digested & summarized by such brilliant scholars as Eisenman & Baigent/Leigh. Many even more insightful texts may still be in the archives of the vatican. I fantasize of some-how/some-day taking control of that vatican library.
> So I suppose in summation succinctly, I propose the "Jews" of the Holy Bible, the nasty ones attributed to killing the Messiah are really the Apostles who were vilified by Paul's Christianity in Asia Minor.
cbs: I don’t think I am reading your intended words correctly, David. You seem to be saying that “the Jews ... the nasty ones attributed to killing the Messiah(,) are really the Apostles”?
Oh, ok. Now that I diagram the sentence, I see that you were probably trying to emphasize the word “Attributed” & “by Paul’s Christianity”.
So, you seem to be saying that “Paul’s Christianity ... Attributed the ... killing of the Messiah” to the Messiah’s True “Apostles”; Correct?
cbs: Hmm. That is indeed a bold & novel proposition. And I have seen that saul/paul did vilify the true apostles on many occasion. But i have difficulty in imagining him being so bold as to actually attribute the killing of Jesus/Yeshuah to them. That would be extremely audacious, even for the subversive saul/paul. If you have any evidence in support of such a bold proposition, I would be interested in reviewing it, good sir.
Godspeed;
charles bruce, stewart
sandy oregon
503-668-3932
charles@christiancommonlaw-gov.org
http://christiancommonlaw-gov.org |
| charles8854 |
Posted - 18 Mar 2005 : 01:45:56
Manuel;
I thank you for your warm welcome.
I also thank you for your supportive affirmation that Jesus/Yeshua was Not a “weakling”, but rather a courageous man who was “extremely brave at heart”.
And your summary there-on that the “written word” has been idolized to the exclusion of the “Works” of the messiah/christ; seem surgically accurate also.
I am very happy that we are of the same mind
on these critically important issues, good sir.
cbs ... |
| David Merrill |
Posted - 14 Mar 2005 : 12:36:00
Let me clarify where I am coming from.
In II Macabees Chapter 3 we find the components of a monetary contraction.
quote:
Now when the holy city was inhabited with all peace, and the laws were kept very well, because of the godliness of Onias the high priest, and his hatred of wickedness, it came to pass that even the kings themselves did honour the place, and magnify the temple with their best gifts; insomuch that Seleucus, king of Asia, of his own revenues bare all the costs belonging to the service of the sacrifices.
I will carefully explain the mechanics of this early "Franchise". The moneychangers were licensed by the Herodians in Jesus' day. They probably paid on a percentage or maybe a purchased license. We have evidence that the Herodians were however operating the sacrifices with foreign currencies by donation. However the moneychangers were selling the Temple Tax half-shekel or drachma at an inflated price to the pilgrims under the illusion that only the drachma or shekel was acceptable currency.
Think this through a bit. The Herodians, being that they accepted donations were probably hoarding the shekel and drachma coins. Contraction. That means the "proper" currency was intentionally being made scarce. A pilgrim would travel all that way for the holiday and then discover he must pay an inflated price to buy the "proper coin" to honor God's laws about Temple Tax. It gets me riled just writing about it.
Imagine what a righteous Jew of the time would think, seeing the injustice in that. Reading my historical scenario into the Gospels am since convinced it was that act above all things, overturning the moneychangers' tables, disrupting commerce that got Jesus hung on the Cross. The Bible indicates he acted alone against many. So therefore there were not a lot of zealots in the Temple yard that day. Jesus lost his temper and was not really acting on any doctrine other than simple justice of monetary tribute to God.
Then you say:
quote:
Further, there were some quotes above from "David Merrill" & "True North", as follows:
"The followers of Jesus of Nazareth, mainly slaves and poor workmen, in their bereavement and disappointment, turned away from the world and formed themselves into a brotherhood of pacifist non-resisters ..."
I think I recall that a quote from Ravage in his articles. His point is not the James version of Jesus' teachings but rather Paul's use of the Resurrection rumors in Roman/Greco pagan Asia Minor. Passive-resistance was a weapon beyond comprehension in the Roman military mindset. The rumors of James being somewhat militant and the post Macabee Jew (remember Masada?) may be, maybe are likely true. We find a faction ready to make Paul shave his head and show honor to the Law even on rumors that he was teaching grace had replaced the Law in Asia Minor. Then presumably that same faction cause Paul to lower himself out a window by rope, running for his life. Later we see a starvation pact to kill Paul for such Temple-defiling doctrine.
You also said:
quote:
The point is, that there is substantial extra-biblical/hard-historical evidence that the followers of Jesus/Yeshua were Not “Pacifists”.
And here I think we may be looking at two distinct factions. The Pauline heresy promulgated through Roman/Greco pagan syncrotism of virgin birth and resurrection. And the other, closer to home was James and the Apostles who knew Jesus. Unlike Paul who only had one encounter with the survived Jesus on the Road to Damascus. Paul indeed taught passivism. But using Paul to define Christianity might be mistaken and limited doctrine. Paul produced a lot of letters out of house arrest in Rome for two years. There are no accidents but that comes awfully close. Considering that the Apostles were free to speak and teach, so they had no motivation to write letters. Paul had them outgunned on the face of human history with all those epistles.
So I suppose in summation succinctly, I propose the "Jews" of the Holy Bible, the nasty ones attributed to killing the Messiah are really the Apostles who were vilified by Paul's Christianity in Asia Minor.
http://friends-n-family-research.info/FFR/Merrill_epistle_dedicatory_1
http://friends-n-family-research.info/FFR/Merrill_epistle_dedicatory_2
Regards,
David Merrill.
|
| Manuel |
Posted - 11 Mar 2005 : 21:20:45
Greetings to you Charles Bruce, and all,
What caught my attention on your intent to communicate of all is:
"The point is, that there is substantial extra-biblical/hard-historical evidence that the followers of Jesus/Yeshua were Not “Pacifists”."
See... many think that The Annointed was, is, and continues to be a weakling, when in fact, no weakling would have, is and continues to be extremely brave at heart. His Words and actions do not seize to this day, and Father willing, for evermore.
It is my heartfelt belief that the problem also comes when many claim and adore the written works of others, yet pull-down and smear His Works.
As Walter reminds on another post, may ieaue welcome you to this forum for all,
I am,
Manuel
|
| charles8854 |
Posted - 11 Mar 2005 : 10:02:22
Hi,
Im new here, but ive been on the net a while, i imagine some of you know me.
I appreciate the call to a higher-standard of debating; ie: maintaining respectful tones (peace), so long as it is possible with each of us.
But i would like to point out in John 8:39 to the end; that Jesus/Yeshuah really cut loose on the children of the original liar. Further; he clearly got so riled-up as to get physically-forceful, in order to route the money-changes from Yhvh's Temple.
Further, there were some quotes above from "David Merrill" & "True North", as follows:
"The followers of Jesus of Nazareth, mainly slaves and poor workmen, in their bereavement and disappointment, turned away from the world and formed themselves into a brotherhood of pacifist non-resisters ..."
And i am un-clear of the positions of "David Merrill" or "True North"; (there is a large amount of text there), but in the spirit of trying to bring the issues into sharper focus so that truth may more easily be discerned; there is a body of research which supports the proposition that the Followers of Jesus were Not “Pacifists”, but rather they were “Zealots”.
This is shown in the profound research of one “Robert Eisenman”; & I quote from part of a review of his book; taken from a web-page following this quote, which reads as follows:
“To anticipate the thrust of the book as a whole, let it be said that Eisenman first draws a portrait of the early community of James as a nationalistic, messianic, priestly, and xenophobic sect of ultra-legal pietism, something most of us would deem fanaticism. As Schweitzer said of the historical Jesus, this is an embarrassment and a disappointment to those who expect the original gospel to look refreshingly modernistic. Eisenman shows how "Jewish Christianity" was part and parcel of the sectarian milieu which included Essenes, Zealots, Nazoreans, Nazirites, Ebionites, Elchasites, Sabeans, Mandaeans, etc., and that these categories were no more than ideal types, by no means actually segregated one from the other like exotic beasts in adjacent, well-marked cages in the theological zoo. Over against this sort of "Lubavitcher Christianity," Eisenman depicts Pauline Christianity (plus its Hellenistic cousins Johannine, Markan, Lukan, etc., Christianities) as being root and branch a compromising, assimilating, Herodianizing apostasy from Judaism. Greek Christianity gives the Torah, and Jewish identity, the bum's rush, just like those allegorizing antinomians Philo argued against, just like Josephus. The Pauline Christ, a spiritual redeemer with an invisible kingdom, is of a piece with the christening of Vespasian as the messiah by Josephus.”
“Of course, these ideas are by no means new. Eisenman is simply filling out the picture in an exhaustive manner undreamt of by S. G. F. Brandon, Robert Eisler, and their congeners. The picture of Jesus in the Greek Gospels, eating with tax-collectors, lampooning the traditions of his people, welcoming sinners and ridiculing Torah piety are all expressions of Gentile anti-Judaism. Only Gentiles utterly without sympathy to Judaism could profess to see such a Jesus as a noble pioneer of a "higher righteousness." In the same way, the New Testament notion that Jerusalem fell because her people had rejected the messiah, when in fact they were fighting a messianic war against the Roman antichrist, must be judged a piece of cynical Hellenistic Jew-bashing. Christianity as it emerges in the Gentile mission is a product of cultural accomodationism, pro-Roman Quislingism, and intentional assimilation. It is a kind of paganized, syncretic, diluted Judaism not unlike the Sabazius cult.”
That quote was from a web-page at the reputable: “Drew University”, here:
http://www.depts.drew.edu/jhc/RPeisenman.html
They patronize Biblical “Higher Criticism”; & I find myself inclined to agree with both Eisenman & this “Higher Criticism” School. Another profound link to Eisenman’s controversial work is here: http://www.depts.drew.edu/jhc/eisenman.html
This may be a simpler summary:
http://wuphys.wustl.edu/~alford/james.html
The point is, that there is substantial extra-biblical/hard-historical evidence that the followers of Jesus/Yeshua were Not “Pacifists”.
And I hate to be a newbie/brown-noser; but “David Merrill” is right-on by echoing the issues raised in the book “Holy-Blood, Holy-Grail”. There is a related book by the same profound authors, entitles “The Dead Sea Scrolls Deception”. This books really rips up the romanized-catholic-church; although it whimps-out on the culpability of the rabbinical-pharisee/jews. I wrote a review of it on amazon, here:
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0671797972/qid=1110551981/sr=2-1/ref=pd_bbs_b_2_1/102-1204379-2382540
(That used price of $1.29 (plus shipping) is incredible, I paid $10.00 or so for my first used copy.)
And there is much more I could write, but I think this is about enuff for my first post in this newly-discovered & very file looking forum.
I would like to say that i take no delight in challenging the heart-felt beliefs of my fellow christians concerning their belief in the “infallibility” of the bible. I am 50 years old, & for most of my life, i believed the same. But there are too many chips on the table in the spiritual-battle, for us to mis-read the terrain of this spiritual war-zone. We have no room for self-induced delusions my fellow spiritual-warriors. Yhvh needs us to be seriously hard-nosed about precisely what is the fine heritage we can derive from our anglo-saxon/celtic christian-commonlaw heritage.
And we need to be hard-nosed about seeking “Truth”. Remember “the Truth will Set You Free”. Yhvh & his true followers have Nothing to Fear from “Truth”.
I do look forward to working with all of you in seeking the advancement of the kingdom of Yhvh on this earth.
Glory to Yhvh,
Charles Bruce, Stewart
Sandy Oregon
503-668-3932, anytime |
| Linc |
Posted - 02 Mar 2005 : 17:29:14
quote:
Originally posted by David Merrill
Albeit Downhomepraise was misled and so would be many new to the concepts of Identity in the pages here on ecclesia.org.
If not for my Israel Identity background, I would never have stumbled across this site. Forgive me for assuming it was the same for the rest of you.
quote:
Oneisraelite should correct what is technically incorrect and proven misleading. Downhomepraise accepted it on face value and also that it bolstered (falsely) the credibility of the author to deviate from accepted standards - Yahuway instead of Yehovah. This is in the heart of things pertinent - the pushy identity of Judah (Yehudah) interjected into the Name of God.
Although I disagree with Oneisraelites pronunciation, I reject all kabbalistic thinking which imputes power and holiness to mere pronunciation. The power of words lies in the effect they have on their hearers. Although I know from my studies that The Name used to be pronounced Yahowah in the original Hebrew, I also know that to convey the same concept and understanding to todays English speakers, I am best off saying "Jehovah".
As a pure Adamic man, given the task of naming things, and indeed making a very good living TODAY by naming things every day, I know how names work. I understand their power and respect it. I will not accept any idolatrous thinking that hides the power of names from others.
Let us move on to more fruitful debates; arguing about pronunciation of words is even more silly than arguing about meanings of words, which Shaul warned against. But then, DM, it appears you reject the writings of Shaul as well.
How can we be in unity in the ecclesia when we disagree on basic facts?
quote:
Sure, it is not a big enough violation for Admin to correct the problem firmware by 'force'. But Oneisraelite can still make his points about "commonwealth" or "spiritual" Israel in the text. And there it would be quite appropriate debate.
Oneisraelite lives in the United States of Manasseh, which is indeed considered part of the Commonwealth of Ephraim. Ephraim was given the blessing of the firstborn, being the chief head and representative of Israel itself, making it fair to call it the Commonwealth of Israel.
quote:
So Linc, I understand your point about assuming I misunderstand the modern Identity of Israel. That is what this Topic is all about. I interjected, quite rudely the extreme views of Rosenthal and Ravage for that purpose. To hash that out.
What do you mean, I do not understand the "modern day Identity of Israel"?
I do not know Rosenthal and Ravage. I did not say you misunderstand, Dave. I said you reject the idea that the Celto-Germanic races are direct descendants of Abraham through his grandson Israel/Jacob. |
| David Merrill |
Posted - 23 Feb 2005 : 09:18:01
Link;
That is a very important point. Thank you for bringing it up. Also, thank you for bringing out that people are clicking 'Active Topics' and reading about it, forming opinions.
It is wonderful that this thread was led back here (thank you, Marty [Cornerstone Foundation]) where it bears the context of your point, Linc:
quote:
The real reason for your disaproval stems from your rejection of the modern day Identity of Israel.
Albeit Downhomepraise was misled and so would be many new to the concepts of Identity in the pages here on ecclesia.org. The bickering has been edifying. Mostly in terms of Legal Identity. Which of course ties intimately to the "Identity of Israel". I think it is clear a proper sense of Identity is crucial to gain control over and avoidance of unwanted contracts (contracts are express relationships).
But primarily it rests upon our each presuming we are correct in our take on identity. And how we identify that "image of God" indentity within us.
Correctly catagorized an item that effects the ecclesia, Topic "advanced-resonance inductive plasma physics" http://ecclesia.org/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=378&whichpage=1 summarizes my entire agenda here. Intervals, octaves and harmonics are amplified by truth. Correctness. This medium is pure in its "1"s and "0"s but complexities of sophistry can disrupt the patterns that develop resonance effects which manifest in mutual agreement - competent common law and supporting case law (stare decisis).
You say you do not understand why I would make a big deal of it. Actually I do not feel I am the one making a big deal of it. Oneisraelite should correct what is technically incorrect and proven misleading. Downhomepraise accepted it on face value and also that it bolstered (falsely) the credibility of the author to deviate from accepted standards - Yahuway instead of Yehovah. This is in the heart of things pertinent - the pushy identity of Judah (Yehudah) interjected into the Name of God.
Sure, it is not a big enough violation for Admin to correct the problem firmware by 'force'. But Oneisraelite can still make his points about "commonwealth" or "spiritual" Israel in the text. And there it would be quite appropriate debate.
So Linc, I understand your point about assuming I misunderstand the modern Identity of Israel. That is what this Topic is all about. I interjected, quite rudely the extreme views of Rosenthal and Ravage for that purpose. To hash that out.
What do you mean, I do not understand the "modern day Identity of Israel"?
Regards,
David Merrill.
See: http://www.jewsnotzionists.org
P.S. Bondservant; It is difficult to remove the bickering from the face of these Posts when Oneisraelite continues to misrepresent where he is writing from on the face of every Post he writes. So I simply point out his misdirection may be used against him, to discredit him, especially if a new member is subject victim to the falsity. True or not about the 'modern Identity of Israel', there are appropriate and inappropriate methods of teaching about it.
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