| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Owenbrittont |
Posted - 10 Nov 2005 : 19:34:05
Anyone know any cites to look up international law ?? or International Laws of War ??? |
| 10 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Livefree |
Posted - 24 Nov 2005 : 00:41:50
From Mercier's Invisible Contracts:
Admiralty Jurisdiction has a sister called Maritime Jurisdiction;
and Maritime, like Admiralty, is a body of Law international in
character, and is considered by Federal Judges to be the Law of
all Nations. [480]
[480]=============================================================
For a commentary on Maritime having an international flair to it,
see the remarks of Gremlin Lord Mansfield, in 35 TULANE LAW
REVIEW, at pages 116 to 118 (1960).
=============================================================[480]
In 1922, Justice Holmes of the United States Supreme Court had a
few words to say about the reason why we are now burdened down
with Maritime Jurisdiction:
"There is no mystic overlaw to which the United States must
bow... However ancient may be the traditions of Maritime Law,
it derives its power from having been accepted in the United
States." [481]
[481]=============================================================
THE WEST MAID, 257 U.S. 419, at 432 (1921).
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| David Merrill |
Posted - 23 Nov 2005 : 08:48:47
I have no direct experience or learning on this subject. But I just look at it logically:
If there is a peace treaty proposed, is not that subsequent to a declaration of war?
Maybe there have been no more than fighting words to date, but there must be some kind of hostility leading to a peace treaty. Of course this may be taken in the context that all commerce is warfare (Miyamoto Musashi and A Book of Five Rings being required reading in Japanese business schools). Therefore if you propose an agreement by presentment and the other party refuses it for cause then you are back in the hostilities of trying to gain a business agreement/competition etc.
I know of a fellow who accepted the peace treaty by acquiescence. A roofer proposed a bid and walked it up to his door. Well the man did not know about this treaty in international law so he said he would think about it and accepted the presentment, presuming a new roof at that price would require him to call the roofer and make further arrangements. The man came home from work four days later to the new roof and the bill.
Regards,
David Merrill.
P.S. War and Emergency Powers 1861/1933 compounded upon Grotius' Just War may bring some sense to the all upper case NAME being a nom de guerre:
http://friends-n-family-research.info/FFR/Merrill_soldier-mathematical.jpg |
| Owenbrittont |
Posted - 23 Nov 2005 : 05:21:24
Particular question....
I have heard that under international law refusing a peace treaty is as good as a declaration of war. ?????? |
| georgealexander |
Posted - 22 Nov 2005 : 09:16:27
I neglected to put quote marks around my snippets in my first post, which are from UNIVERSAL CLASSICS LIBRARY, Water Dunne, Publisher, 1901. Translated from the original Latin by A C Campbell, AM. Introduction (from which the snippets were copied) by David J Hill, Assistant Secretary of State of the United States.
I have read little of Grotius, but came away in agreeance with the Introduction.
The development of the 'laws of the sea' probably commencing with the Rhodian laws were rules of order governing conduct with shipper/traders on the sea and in sea ports. Law Maritima.
Commerce was developed around ports as well as trade fairs which later became cities. Traders developed 'laws of trade' around such fairs. Lex Mercatoria.
Grotius wrote about 'Free Seas' in 1601 (?) while RIGHTS OF WAR AND PEACE was written 25 years later. This is all in the Wikipedia url. The Fordham url specifically categorizes Grotius under 'modern' and 'international'.
Regarding my second and separate post, I was merely offering two rather diverse urls touching on Storey.
I will probably buy the Cornforth book, although that would be the 3rd 'new' book I have purchased recently.......my Classics Library, 10 volumes were less than $1.00. Last week I purchased 7 volumes of Chambers's Encyclopaedia 1890 for $7.
'Adventures in Legal Land' and 'Cracking the Code' were about $20 a pop and neither had an index, generally a deterrent for me.
Big Brother will have a scrap on his hands if he attempts to 'sanitize' my library.
George Alexander
ps: LATE BREAKING NEWS!!!!
http://www.constitution.org/gro/djbp.htm
'Cheaply received, Freely Given'
found while testing
Scroogle.org
Be there or be square.
ga
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| David Merrill |
Posted - 21 Nov 2005 : 10:01:59
quote:
It is historically accurate to say, that, until formulated by Grotius, Europe possessed no system of international law........
quote:
The earliest attempt to formulate recognized international customs was the formation of the early maritime codes, rendered necessary by the expansion of mediaeval commerce from the end of the eleventh to the end of the sixteenth century, such as the "Jugemens d'Oleron", adopted by the merchants of France, England, and Spain and reissued under other names for the merchants of The Netherlands and the Blatic. "The Consolato del Mare", a more elaborate compilation, was made apparently at Barcelona, about the middle of the fourteenth century and accepted generally by the traders of the chief maritime powers. It was in the cradle of commerce, therefore that international law awoke to consciousness.
I am not certain which book or law you are inquiring about.
quote:
Oh! THAT old law.
So I presume you distinguish international law from admiralty law. You may be right.
Otherwise I suppose that Joanne Tooke's book The Just War of Grotius and Aquinas is not available on the Internet. It is down at the federal repository and I checked it out to read it a few years ago.
Here is something that looks to be worth the cash. The book is titled, Thou Teacheth My Hand to War by Richard Cornforth.
http://www.richardcornforth.com/seminars.htm
http://www.richardcornforth.com/shop/
Regards,
David Merrill.
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| georgealexander |
Posted - 20 Nov 2005 : 08:09:25
Oh! THAT old law.
I need to audit my BOOKMARKS:
http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/sbook-law.html
Down toward the bottom you will find Grotius.
David, is this the 'sanitized' version??
http://www.lonang.com/exlibris/story/index.html
or this:
http://www.admiraltylawguide.com/histdocs.html
George Alexander
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| David Merrill |
Posted - 19 Nov 2005 : 19:05:53
Curious that I am certain Justice Story mentioned in Delovio v. Boit both the Laws of Oleron and the Black Book of the Admiralty in adjudicating that all insurance contracts (bottomry) would be admiralty jurisdiction regardless of the high-tide mark. But the Internet copies available of the case say nothing of the sort. They pruned the federal repository miserably when they consolidated it and now I cannot find the case where I read it before. They seem to have lost the four-volume index too. Sad.
Here is a snippet from the endnotes in Joanne Tooke's The Just War of Grotius and Aquinas. I have always related this to the formation of the all upper case nom de guerre (Fr. name of war).
http://friends-n-family-research.info/FFR/Merrill_soldier-mathematical.jpg
Regards,
David Merrill. |
| georgealexander |
Posted - 19 Nov 2005 : 14:31:54
The Predecessors of Grotius
It is historically accurate to say, that, until formulated by Grotius, Europe possessed no system of international law........
The earliest attempt to formulate recognized international customs was the formation of the early maritime codes, rendered necessary by the expansion of mediaeval commerce from the end of the eleventh to the end of the sixteenth century, such as the "Jugemens d'Oleron", adopted by the merchants of France, England, and Spain and reissued under other names for the merchants of The Netherlands and the Blatic. "The Consolato del Mare", a more elaborate compilation, was made apparently at Barcelona, about the middle of the fourteenth century and accepted generally by the traders of the chief maritime powers. It was in the cradle of commerce, therefore that international law awoke to consciousness.
"De Jure Billi ac Pacis" written later in Grotius' life has been interpreted "The Rights of WAR AND PEACE including THE LAW OF NATURE AND OF NATIONS".
GOOGLE will generally find any of the above key words to be footnotes on quite a number of sites.
George Alexander
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| Oneisraelite |
Posted - 19 Nov 2005 : 06:56:58
Hugo Grotius (Huig de Groot, or Hugo de Groot; Delft, 10th April 1583 - Rostock, 28th August 1645) worked as a jurist in the Dutch Republic and laid the foundations for international law, based on natural law. - From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.
The natural law or law of nature is a system of the justice that exists independently of the positive law of a given political order. - From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.
law of nature
• noun 1 another term for NATURAL LAW. - Compact Oxford English Dictionary
natural law
• noun 1 a body of unchanging moral principles regarded as inherent in all human beings and forming a basis for human conduct. - Compact Oxford English Dictionary
8. Moral law, a law which prescribes to men their religious and social duties, in other words, their duties to God and to each other. The moral law is summarily contained in the decalogue or ten commandments, written by the finger of God on two tables of stone, and delivered to Moses on mount Sinai. - Webster's 1828 American Dictionary of the English Language
3. Law of nature, is a rule of conduct arising out of the natural relations of human beings established by the Creator, and existing prior to any positive precept. Thus it is a law of nature, that one man should not injure another, and murder and fraud would be crimes, independent of any prohibition from a supreme power. - Webster's 1828 American Dictionary of the English Language
And He declared unto you His covenant [H1285], which He commanded you to perform, even Ten Commandments; and He wrote them upon two tables of stone.
H1285
beriyth
BDB Definition:
...1a2) constitution
My yoke is easy, and my burden is light
For this is the love of YaHuWaH,
that we keep His Commandments:
and His Commandments are not grievous.
fellowcitizen of the commonwealth of Yisra'el,
NOT the man-made, fictional USA.
Ephesians 2:12 & 19
An act done by me against my will is not my act. |
| georgealexander |
Posted - 18 Nov 2005 : 09:10:31
It all starts with this man:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hugo_Grotius
George Alexander
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